Who Made These Tuners

Mr. P ~

Gone But Not Forgotten
Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jan 6, 2006
Messages
1,676
Reaction score
0
Location
Huntsville, Alabama
:shock: Since I got this 1978 D-40, I have been going nuts trying to determine the manufacturer of these tuners. No ID marks visible or hidden on the bottom. I am going to replace them because the String post wobbles so much that tightening the adjustment screw enough to control it makes them difficult to turn.

You can tell when the machines are off that these were the original equipment. Must have been a bad time for Guild! :roll:

I don't like the two screw mounted Kluson style like Gibson used, and I don't want to use Waverlys, so I guess I will Patch holes and use the Grover Rotomatics.

Any comment on that route Hans?


f07dc0b5.jpg


f07dc08a.jpg
 

Mr. P ~

Gone But Not Forgotten
Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jan 6, 2006
Messages
1,676
Reaction score
0
Location
Huntsville, Alabama
:shock: Since I got this 1978 D-40, I have been going nuts trying to determine the manufacturer of these tuners. No ID marks visible or hidden on the bottom. I am going to replace them because the String post wobbles so much that tightening the adjustment screw enough to control it makes them difficult to turn.

You can tell when the machines are off that these were the original equipment. Must have been a bad time for Guild! :roll:

I don't like the two screw mounted Kluson style like Gibson used, and I don't want to use Waverlys, so I guess I will Patch holes and use the Grover Rotomatics.

Any comment on that route Hans?


f07dc0b5.jpg


f07dc08a.jpg
 

West R Lee

Venerated Member
Joined
Nov 19, 2005
Messages
17,741
Reaction score
2,663
Location
East Texas
Don't know Mr. P. I've seen those several times and have always thought they looked good. Sorry to hear about your problem. I've looked in Hans' book and can't find them, but I'm sure he'll know who made them and if there is something that is interchangeable without drilling or plugging holes.
 

West R Lee

Venerated Member
Joined
Nov 19, 2005
Messages
17,741
Reaction score
2,663
Location
East Texas
Don't know Mr. P. I've seen those several times and have always thought they looked good. Sorry to hear about your problem. I've looked in Hans' book and can't find them, but I'm sure he'll know who made them and if there is something that is interchangeable without drilling or plugging holes.
 

hansmoust

Enlightened Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
9,201
Reaction score
3,505
Location
Netherlands
Mr. P ~ said:
Since I got this 1978 D-40, I have been going nuts trying to determine the manufacturer of these tuners. No ID marks visible or hidden on the bottom. I am going to replace them because the String post wobbles so much that tightening the adjustment screw enough to control it makes them difficult to turn.

You can tell when the machines are off that these were the original equipment. Must have been a bad time for Guild! :roll:

I don't like the two screw mounted Kluson style like Gibson used, and I don't want to use Waverlys, so I guess I will Patch holes and use the Grover Rotomatics.

Any comment on that route Hans?

Hi Mr. P.

Those tuners were introduced in the mid-'70s and they were made by Gotoh. Without going to my database I believe these tuners were first used on the D-40 and later on in the '70s they were used on the D-35, G-37 and on some medium priced electric solid bodies as well.

They're not great tuners; I guess you could call them OK tuners!
It uses the same 10mm peghead hole that most modern machineheads require, so that would be an easy fix. The only good quality machinehead that uses the same screw hole setup is another Gotoh made type that is patterned after the old Kluson Sealfast machine. It's the one that was used on the original Gruhn designed Guild models from the '80s.
Here's a photo of them:
http://www.guitarchives.nl/guitarsgalore/parts_detail.php?id=67
Anyway, they're not exactly the same footprint and you already mentioned that you didn't like the 2-screw fastening arrangement, so I guess you should go ahead and use regular Grover RotoMatics. They're reliable and you only need t take care of the little screw holes.

Good luck!

Hans Moust
 

hansmoust

Enlightened Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
9,201
Reaction score
3,505
Location
Netherlands
Mr. P ~ said:
Since I got this 1978 D-40, I have been going nuts trying to determine the manufacturer of these tuners. No ID marks visible or hidden on the bottom. I am going to replace them because the String post wobbles so much that tightening the adjustment screw enough to control it makes them difficult to turn.

You can tell when the machines are off that these were the original equipment. Must have been a bad time for Guild! :roll:

I don't like the two screw mounted Kluson style like Gibson used, and I don't want to use Waverlys, so I guess I will Patch holes and use the Grover Rotomatics.

Any comment on that route Hans?

Hi Mr. P.

Those tuners were introduced in the mid-'70s and they were made by Gotoh. Without going to my database I believe these tuners were first used on the D-40 and later on in the '70s they were used on the D-35, G-37 and on some medium priced electric solid bodies as well.

They're not great tuners; I guess you could call them OK tuners!
It uses the same 10mm peghead hole that most modern machineheads require, so that would be an easy fix. The only good quality machinehead that uses the same screw hole setup is another Gotoh made type that is patterned after the old Kluson Sealfast machine. It's the one that was used on the original Gruhn designed Guild models from the '80s.
Here's a photo of them:
http://www.guitarchives.nl/guitarsgalore/parts_detail.php?id=67
Anyway, they're not exactly the same footprint and you already mentioned that you didn't like the 2-screw fastening arrangement, so I guess you should go ahead and use regular Grover RotoMatics. They're reliable and you only need t take care of the little screw holes.

Good luck!

Hans Moust
 

Mr. P ~

Gone But Not Forgotten
Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jan 6, 2006
Messages
1,676
Reaction score
0
Location
Huntsville, Alabama
Thanks West and Hans!

I didn't state it correctly, what I don't like is the Gibson style. I think the two screw mount is the best method if you don't have a threaded collar/bushing like the Rotomatics.

Hans, I saw the ones your referenced in your catalog and I wondered if that was the right screw patern, but they are obviously out of production.

I may try disassembling one to see if I could repair them, but there does not appear to be a good way into them.

Thanks for the Positive Vibes!
8)
 

Mr. P ~

Gone But Not Forgotten
Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jan 6, 2006
Messages
1,676
Reaction score
0
Location
Huntsville, Alabama
Thanks West and Hans!

I didn't state it correctly, what I don't like is the Gibson style. I think the two screw mount is the best method if you don't have a threaded collar/bushing like the Rotomatics.

Hans, I saw the ones your referenced in your catalog and I wondered if that was the right screw patern, but they are obviously out of production.

I may try disassembling one to see if I could repair them, but there does not appear to be a good way into them.

Thanks for the Positive Vibes!
8)
 
Joined
Jan 4, 2006
Messages
6
Reaction score
0
Location
Arizona
Great Info. I have a 77 D40 with the same tuners and have always wondered about the manufacturer. FWIW I have had no problems with mine.
 
Joined
Jan 4, 2006
Messages
6
Reaction score
0
Location
Arizona
Great Info. I have a 77 D40 with the same tuners and have always wondered about the manufacturer. FWIW I have had no problems with mine.
 
Joined
Nov 19, 2005
Messages
458
Reaction score
0
Location
Baton Rouge, Louisiana
tuning bad tuna

My 75 G-37 had those machines Hans described (as did my borhter's) and they actually lasted until about 1980 when the posts got so wobbly I was driven to near madness. I replaced them with Grovers that have been on there ever since. (Again, same with my brothers.) So, Mr. P - I know from whence you speak! dbs

Dudley-Brian Smith
Guild - Westerly's finest to the world!
 
Joined
Nov 19, 2005
Messages
458
Reaction score
0
Location
Baton Rouge, Louisiana
tuning bad tuna

My 75 G-37 had those machines Hans described (as did my borhter's) and they actually lasted until about 1980 when the posts got so wobbly I was driven to near madness. I replaced them with Grovers that have been on there ever since. (Again, same with my brothers.) So, Mr. P - I know from whence you speak! dbs

Dudley-Brian Smith
Guild - Westerly's finest to the world!
 

Mr. P ~

Gone But Not Forgotten
Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jan 6, 2006
Messages
1,676
Reaction score
0
Location
Huntsville, Alabama
My D-40 was obviously used by a working musician judging from all the dings on either side of the lower boughts, the finish blemishes from vinyl parts of guitar stands and the finish dings on the back top edge of the head.

So if figure the former owner did not know that the screw in the button was and adjutment and let them stay loose for a long time. That in turn wore out the bearing surfaces inside. So that post wobble that DBS had fits with is a problem for me, but tightening the adjustment screw takes out most of the wobble....but makes the tension on the machine very high.

Anyway, I expect that some nice Grover Rotomatics will replace them soon. I have had good luck with them both times I have bought them.
 

Mr. P ~

Gone But Not Forgotten
Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jan 6, 2006
Messages
1,676
Reaction score
0
Location
Huntsville, Alabama
My D-40 was obviously used by a working musician judging from all the dings on either side of the lower boughts, the finish blemishes from vinyl parts of guitar stands and the finish dings on the back top edge of the head.

So if figure the former owner did not know that the screw in the button was and adjutment and let them stay loose for a long time. That in turn wore out the bearing surfaces inside. So that post wobble that DBS had fits with is a problem for me, but tightening the adjustment screw takes out most of the wobble....but makes the tension on the machine very high.

Anyway, I expect that some nice Grover Rotomatics will replace them soon. I have had good luck with them both times I have bought them.
 
Top