Open 'Letter to the Editor' of Vintage Guitar Magazine:

hansmoust

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Letter to the editor:

Just read the Guild S-200 Thunderbird 'Instrument Profile' by Michael Wright in the November 2006 issue. I'm really sorry to say that, apart from the social commentary, the article is full of mistakes and almost all the factual information is wrong. The fact that the information is wrong doesn't bother me that much; we all make mistakes. What bothers me is that most of the information could be checked if one would take the trouble.

Here are quotes from the article followed by a comment from me:

All three of Guild’s new solidbodies had glued-in necks, with a groovy asymetrical ‘Florentine’ headstock design on the Thunderbird and Jet-Star and a reverse six-in-line on the Polara.

That is not correct. All three solidbodies had a similar shaped ‘Florentine’ headstock when they were introduced in 1963. The six-in-line headstock wasn’t used before 1965.

Initially, the S-200 was equipped with small Guild ‘Anti-Hum’ humbucking pickups. How long these were used is unknown, but at some point (probably early on) Guild switched to ‘Frequency Tested’ single-coils manufactured by DeArmond, as seen on the guitar shown here.

The humbucking units were used into 1965. The switch from humbucking pickups to the small single coils (aka Mickey Mouse pickups) took place during 1965. Also, these small single coils were not manufactured by DeArmond.

The Thunderbird was also equipped with a version of the Hagstrom knife-edge vibrato. Whether Guild licensed the design and made its own or obtained them from Sweden is unknown.

These vibratos were obtained from Hagstrom, who were distributing the Guild line in Sweden, together with the adjusto-matic bridges, tuning machines and pickups that Guild was using on a variety of their guitars and basses.


Before 1964, Guild guitars had a headstock design that was very similar to Gibson’s open-book shape. That year Guild switched to a new center-humped shape for its acoustics and archtops, and at some unknown point close to this, Guild ditched the Florentine head for the new standard shape seen here, possibly as early as ’64.

The first guitars with the center-raised headstock were done in 1962 (not counting the Johnny Smith Award Model that already had the center-raised profile in 1956) and the design change was incorporated into the regular model line during the course of the following years. The S-200 however kept the ‘Florentine’ headstock into the year 1965.

We have to be a little vague here because Guild never bothered to change the Florentine art in its catalog through ’68, though the majority of Thunderbirds that show up have the standard head.

Catalogs in general are not a very good source for information. Most manufacturers often use photos long after the specs for a specific model have been changed and Guild was certainly no exception. In my research I have found that the change from the ‘Florentine’ headstock to the ‘regular’ center-raised style took place around the same time that the serial number system was changed, which was towards the end of 1965. My database already contains more Thunderbirds from the 1963-1965 period with the ‘Florentine’ headstock than the official 91 that were produced since the change of the serial number system, which makes me wonder what the claim that ‘the majority of Thunderbirds that show up have the standard head’ is based on.

Thunderbirds were available from ’63 to ’69 in cherry or sunburst finishes.

Cherry and sunburst were indeed the colors mentioned in the catalogs and price list but the price lists also mentioned optional colors and I’ve come across quite a few Walnut and Black examples.

The downscale Polara and Jet-Star were a little more conservative in shape and sported the ‘Frequncy Tested’ DeArmonds, but did not have the fancy electronics or built-in stand.

The pickups used on the Polara and the Jet-Star were always Guild pickups and they were not manufactured by DeArmond.
When these 3 solidbodies were introduced in 1963, both the S-200 Thunderbird and the S-100 Polara had the built-in stand.

It’s not known exactly how many of these early Guild solidbodies were made, but probably not many. Records indicate about 90 Thunderbirds were produced; the serial number on this ’66 Thunderbird is SC 120, SC being the Thunderbird prefix.
Knowing that 90 are accounted for, this number suggests consecutive numbering that reflects actual production totals.


Guild’s serial number system was changed during the year 1965.
The new serial number system used a two letter prefix for each individual model followed by consecutive numbers starting with # 101. The last number for 1968 was SC-191 indicating a total production of 91 guitars since the start of the new serial number system up to and including 1968.

....there were probably 30 or so made in ’63-’64. Add a few more for ’68 and the total output is likely 150 or fewer, qualifying the Guild Thunderbird as being of the rare variety that never really flew.

Right now I have more than 200 Thunderbirds from the 1963-1965 period in my database. These are actual existing guitars that I’ve personally checked and in the cases where the info was given by other people, I did get photos.
I have the serial numbers and all of the specs. of these individual models including the headstock shape, pickups that were used and the finish color, and these are only the ones that I’ve come across.
Knowing the way that Guild worked and the usual size of their batches I could ‘fill in’ the missing numbers in between known serial numbers and the possible number of Thunderbirds would be quite a bit higher.
All of this again makes me wonder what the author’s claim that ‘the total output is likely 150 or fewer’ is based on. What is the source of this information?

As a writer you have a responsibility towards the reader who might go out and spend a couple of thousand dollars on the basis of what you wrote. And we’ve just seen the first eBay auction in which the seller quotes the info from this article to sell a non-original Guild Thunderbird for $ 6000.00.

Sincerely,

Hans Moust / author ‘The Guild Guitar Book’
http://www.guitarsgalore.nl
 

Squawk

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Hans -

Excellent piece - you probably opened up a can of worms regarding other articles this reporter might have written - but it needed to be done.

I have had Gretsch "experts" tell me my particular guitar could not have been made before the early 1970's - when I bought it used in 1967. I might be a geezer, but even if my memory is off, dated pictures aren't.

Bottom line is do the research before you conclude - and if a statement is not 100% verified, say it's an opinion or guess.

I fell in love with the Thunderbird when I saw the color pictures in your book. So did a lot of other folks as I never came near in any ebay auction. To exaggerate its rarity does justice to no one.

Thanks again - and have a great trip - too bad you won't be in the New York area - and I can't get to Texas now :(
 

Accept2

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Michael Wright's stuff is always full of errors. Sometimes I wonder if he just makes the shit up himself............
 
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