Just curious

Graham

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I only play acoustic at the moment. For any of you that started the same way, what was the draw to electric and specifically these models?

Some of the guitars themselves are beautiful I admit that, but what is it about playability?

With an acoustic I can play anywhere I want to, without power. What are the limitations with the guitars in this category?

I guess what I'm looking for are reasons to play these guitars. I have an Epiphone SG in the house that belongs to my son and I have picked it up on occassion but nothing serious, probably because my repertoire is extrememly limited at the moment anyway.

Are all archtops and hollowbodies, F holes? Does that make them semi-acoustic?

Who do you try to emulate? I just watched a clip of Buddy Guy and that was just tremendous.

Thanks
 

northbayj

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Hi Graham,

I migrated toward archtops because a) I think they look cool, and b) I got serious about developing some jazz chops and I wanted the real deal. So a couple years back I sold my 67 Gretsch TEnnessean and bought an X500. I love it. Totally. It's just an awesome guitar. I could go on and on, but to your question about how archtops compare to flat tops, I'll get to the point.

Most Guild archtops (X500s, X175s, 170s, etc.) have laminated tops. So while they are pretty close to fully accoustic guitars, they don't project like a good flat top. Yes, they're extremely resonant and loud when unplugged, but you don't quite get the same harmonic richness or volume as a fully accoustic solid top guitar. On the other hand, the very top of the line Guilds - Artist Awards and x700s - have carved spruce tops, and respond very much like accoustic guitars - because basically they are. I've played AAs at music stores, and my old guitar teacher had a very nice Gibson L5 (carved top) and both models project incredibly well, and sound very rich. Different than a flat top, but very very cool. Give one a try some time!

John
 

yettoblaster

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I started on a Kay electric when I was ten, but about a year later was allowed to use some of "grandma's College" money she had invested for me to get a 1961 Gibson J-45!

I played that exclusively for about 10 years. Then in the service a guy owed me on a bet and gave me a Univox les paul lookin' electric. Seemed interesting, but not like a "real guitar."
Slinky strings are a bit like "power steering" though. :)

When I got out of the service in '72 I knocked around the country with a seismic crew for a couple of years and would get cheap electrics like Danelectro's from pawn shops to practice on, rather than take my J-45 on the road.
I'd sell 'em before I boarded the plane to the next town.

Eventually I put a Danelectro neck on a 2 X 4 and could break it down and stash it in my big ol' Samsonite suitcase for flights.

I put a add-on pickup on it and recorded Malaguanea, etc direct into a guy's cassette recorder once in our hotel room, but mostly just used it to hone Blues licks while I watched TV with the sound off.

I decided I wanted to play music instead of work on nuclear power construction sites, so "turned pro," bought a ES-175, and moved to California!
Went to College as a Music Major and joined the Musician's Union in 1974.

Oddly enough, my first studio date I was playing a Martin D-18 with a Lawrence FT-45 magnetic soundhole pickup on it, direct into the board. :shock:

I was a Union hack for 20 years off and on, playing mostly Telecasters in orchestra pits for Miss America Pageant Franchises (Miss Santa Clara, Miss Salinas, Miss Santa Cruz, etc etc). Mostly Showtunes and Big Band.

Of course around here real musicians have day jobs! :wink: And that's what bought our house and clothed the kids, etc.

Now I just play Jazz jobs at resturants/bars etc. for hardly any money, but it's what I've always wanted to do. I use my X-150 Savoy and a Polytone or tweed Deluxe clone.

All that to say this:
Over the years I've tried to get a decent amplified acoustic guitar sound, but finally gave up. It's just easier to use an electric guitar with a magnetic pickup!
Plus there's more sustain with an electric. 8)
That, and with light strings, it's like power steering! :wink:
 

john_kidder

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I'm certainly no pro player, and I'm still very much a newcomer to the world of electric guitars, so this posting should be taken with several pounds of salt.

I've had only acoustic guitars for years - travelling light, etc. Like many folkies and singers, my guitars would have been perfectly suitable without frets above (say) the fifth - just never got up there, past the cowboy chords in open positions. Started buying a Guild or two here and there 3 or 4 years ago, at the same time as I took my first swing/jazz guitar classes. Well - all of a sudden the whole guitar became the instrument, and things changed.

A few of the Guilds I went through were electro-acoustic - the F-5CE, F-15CE, and FF-5CE in particular had 24-fret necks and (obviously) cutaways for access - and I could plug them in. Didn't like the guitars that much, but all those notes up there plus the extra dynamic range from an amplified guitar were intriguing.

Then I bought a '56 X-50 hollow-body, with a single Franz pickup, and life changed again. This was an electric guitar, not an acoustic with a pickup. And it was huge fun. A different instrument, led to a whole different kind of playing - starting looking at jazzier progressions, bending notes, little bits of chord/melody playing. AND - what about that "reverb", "chorus", "distortion", and all those other cool knobs there on my Roland JC-55 amp? What happens if I take the treble down on the guitar and try to boost it from the amp? Do I get a different sound? With any acoustic, one can move the sound around quite a bit with different finger/pick attack, muting, positioning, etc., and likewise on the fretting hand, but nothing like what one can play with on an electric guitar. Nothing.

And now I have a big jazzer - one of the early '50s X-somethings that Hans describes as being made of a few different parts that were lying about - early long-scale neck on a slightly later body, etc. I like to think of it as an X-400, but who knows. Now this is a whole different animal again. There's some real authority here - it's a big guitar, it plays big, and it sounds great and fat and full. Now I have a big box with fat flatwound strings, a big Thunderbass tube amp (just retubed and tuned up - wow) and a 2x10 cab (just reconed - wow). This is humbling - there's just so much guitar to work with, and it all sounds so remarkable, that I feel as if I'm back in Grade 1.

And, two weeks ago, my '89 Nightbird arrives. A bewildering array of switches and controls - what is an old acoustic player to do with two powered pickups, coil-tap control and phase switch? Well, what an old acoustic player is to do is to learn again that a great electric instrument opens new doors every day - with even a little simple amp like the T1-12, I'm having more fun, and learning more music and musical styles, more rapidly than I would have thought possible. What glorious sounds it makes - I can run over a simple progression many times, and the slightest variations in playing style can generate much different expression - it's just marvellous.

The electric guitar can be a means to a whole different expression of your musical thoughts. And yet somehow these electrical machines make me feel even closer and more intimately connected to old woden boxes like my M-20.

It all works.
 

Squawk

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Archtops are - well, different. I have two that acoustically project as well as a flattop (neither is a Guild); and a few others (Guilds included) that can hold their own acoustically. Like flattops, all sound different - and even more different plugged.

I suggest you try a few (not just one). Might have a problem finding Guilds, but others do abound in most music stores.
 

california

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Graham --

Until I started playing in this sandbox I thought that all electrics were the same -- not much. I thought a pickup was something that I tried to do years ago when I was single. TWIN picups were, well.... Then I began reading the Archtops/Hollowbodies section on LTG and started getting curious. My first venture, at Don's suggestion, was a DeArmond Starfire Special. It was the best $500 I ever spent. There's something about the feel and the care in construction of a good archtop that hooked my right away. Next thing I did was to get a good amp, and -- well -- wow! The way you can change expression with one instrument was overwhelming.

My next foray into the world of electrics was my '78 X-175. Lovingly used, it is like holding history every time I pick it up. I'm not a great player, but the jazz sounds that come from that guitar are some of the most comforting sounds on the planet. I'm like you Graham -- my sights were totally set on my DV-52 as my guitar of choice. My trip to the candy store is still my 12-string, but bit by it a funny thing is happening -- despite 40 something years of playing acoustics, for pure confort and relaxation the X-175 is becoming my favorite Guild, the one I pick up first when settling down to relax after work.

IMHO, you've really got to give a good archtop a try -- you'll be hooked.
 

Graham

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Thanks David, the more I read about guitar, especially Guild, the more curious I become. Like I said I have access to an SG model here at home, so far it hasn't done anything for me yet, but these archtops and such, there gorgeous to look at so I was wondering about they're playability.

Where have you been anyway?
 

california

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Graham said:
So what would be considered a "starter" model now? Not that I'm looking or anything. :roll:

Not just because I'm selling one but.... The DeArmonds have the look and feel of guilds at 1/3 the cost. The Starfire Special is like an X-170 (only heavier) and the X-155 feels and sounds like an X-175 or X-300.
 

Graham

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Does an arch top "open up" with age as does an acoustic?

What does one look for in choosing one of these? Is it the same as the flat tops?

This is loads of fun, for me, looking into this stuff, and I may as well ask the guys that play them.

With the acoustics I can play them and hear their tone and from reading here and Hans' book the differences in tone wood can be apparent, but when it gets into the electrics and stuff???

I read you guys talk about pups (pick ups?) and pots and Bigsby, which I take to be a mechanical bender, as opposed to a liquid bender, :shock:

What makes one pickup better than another? Or one tail piece? Does the f-hole play much in terms of sound or is it more appearance anymore?

There are some beautiful looking guitars out there and some of the new prices are lower than what I thought. Like the Gretsch 5125 for instance.

Is this an entirely new learning curve or just an extension of the acoustic?

Thanks
 
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