Question about the headstock's logo on a M-75 Aristocrat

Blues&BebopFan

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Hi everyone,

Recently I've found on a website a picture of a 1957 Guild M-75 aristocrat in what seems to be a mint condition. What strikes me was the fact that the logo was diagonal on the headstock. I've never seen this before. You can often found those model on 'Retrofret Vintage Guitar' Website but I've never witnessed a model with the same logo even from Aristocrat made the same year.

I'm very curious to know what you think about it and to have an explanation.

I wish you all a great day,
Thanks for your help,
Alexis Nootens

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Thanks for your reply!!
Curious, so they just used it in 1957 ? After they stopped using a diagonal logo I guess ?
 
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Yea it was somewhere between late 56’ and mid 57’ they used this ‘script’ logo on a few models as GGJaguar mentioned. I wonder if they got in trouble by Gibson or Epiphone (pre Gibson) since the headstock shape and script are so similar to both. I have a 57’ with script logo and it’s a killer guitar. And yes they are more rare then the other logos, and to me more unique :) There were many logo changes in the first 5 years of the company, and they landed with the “peak” logo and chesterfield inlay in late 57’, and around 64’ went with the now recognized ‘domed’ headstock instead of the open book Gibson-style.


IMG_5088.jpg
 
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Thank you so much Dylan McGee Jones for this complete answer!
I really appreciate you both took the time to answer me!

Your Aristocrat is sublime!!! And it looks like it's 100% original, you even have the golden circle around the pickup switch! Yeah I know it's a killer guitar, it has been my dream since someone borrowed it me one for a week. I'v been trying to save money since to hopefully buy one but those are very very rare in Europe... I really appreciate the light weight and how full they sound despite being "small" guitars.
 

SFIV1967

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The diagonal script logo was reused on multiple models later on, like the Paloma and the new P-240:

1691537411245.png 1691537510164.png

Tacoma used it straight:

1691537669108.png

And Ren Ferguson used it on all NH made Orpheum models:

1691537609455.png 1691537627050.png

Ralf
 

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Thank you so much SFIV1967 for these informations.

I didn't know those models nor Ren Ferguson.
I've plenty to learn!
 
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Thank you so much Dylan McGee Jones for this complete answer!
I really appreciate you both took the time to answer me!

Your Aristocrat is sublime!!! And it looks like it's 100% original, you even have the golden circle around the pickup switch! Yeah I know it's a killer guitar, it has been my dream since someone borrowed it me one for a week. I'v been trying to save money since to hopefully buy one but those are very very rare in Europe... I really appreciate the light weight and how full they sound despite being "small" guitars.
@Blues&BebopFan - I have been fantasizing about buying a vintage Aristocrat for almost 20 years now, and all I can say is I would absolutely recommend picking one up if possible. The vintage ones are super expensive (relatively - it it said Gibson it would be $15k at this point), and have doubled in price over the last 15 years or so. In the Guild world of collectibility and future value it is one of the best by far, and with people like Joe Bonamassa/St. Vincent/Jack White picking one up and promoting it I would only expect the price to go up. They are truly unique, and purely a Guild invention, made for the gigging jazz guitarist in NY in the 1950's. Lightweight, and they sound incredible, super easy to play! It projects well acoustically so you can spend hours just noodling on the couch unplugged without even noticing, and 4.5 lbs (give or take) means that it won't break your back on a gig.

I would even recommend picking up a used Newark Street one from 2014-present just to get a feel for it. They are a fraction of the price, almost the exact same build, and they too are light weight and sound really killer for a MIK guitar. My 57' is woody and warm, and the Franz pickups break up in the best kind of way because they are low wound so you can crank the amp up to its sweet spot and the guitar can live right there without too much breakup. Or get the amp hot, and let your fingers create the dynamics! The ONLY downside is that it will feed back if turned up high enough as it is fully hollow. The MIK is very similar, but the lacquer finish and slightly brighter Franz reissue pickups are not as warm/woody/vintage sounding and it needs to be broken in a bit. I got around this by adding flat wounds and a wooden bridge similar to the ones from the 50's. Semi-flats will probably do the trick as well. Also the bridge on the new ones is pinned to the top unlike the vintage ones which float and can scratch the top if not handled properly. You can see the bridge wear on the top of my 57' for instance.

This is my 2015. I added Kluson vintage tuners with cream buttons (nothing wrong with stock tuners, just an aesthetic choice), a Guild ebony arch top bridge, and a toggle switch plate that matched the vibe. Its a killer guitar. Also for the record, the new ones have plastic inlays similar to a Rickenbacker. Oddly enough, there was an era of Aristocrats that had clouded plastic inlays in the 50's, my 57' is one of them! They tend to shrink and fall out over time, and you should always look to see if they were replaced (its a good thing if they were since it is an expensive job, but it technically decreases value - whatever that actually means in this Guild underworld). Im pretty sure most of the later 50's-early 60's models are all block pearl. Also, if you are seriously considering making the 5K purchase, make sure it comes with its original brown Lifton case as they are also valuable ($400-$500 ish)!

IMG_1835.jpg

@SFIV1967 Ralf I forgot about those! Wow, i remember trying them out somewhere before the Cordoba acquisition and not liking them at all. Maybe because there were a handful of vintage D-40's and D-55's next to them! I had no idea they released brand new models with the same script logo! My vintage one has a much better inlay in that it is an actual inlay and not a graphic, and I purposely sought out the script logo on this particular model as it is rare and rad. I hope the new Guilds are better that the ones from the 2010's era. My experience may have been a bit skewed.
 

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@Blues&BebopFan - I have been fantasizing about buying a vintage Aristocrat for almost 20 years now, and all I can say is I would absolutely recommend picking one up if possible. The vintage ones are super expensive (relatively - it it said Gibson it would be $15k at this point), and have doubled in price over the last 15 years or so. In the Guild world of collectibility and future value it is one of the best by far, and with people like Joe Bonamassa/St. Vincent/Jack White picking one up and promoting it I would only expect the price to go up. They are truly unique, and purely a Guild invention, made for the gigging jazz guitarist in NY in the 1950's. Lightweight, and they sound incredible, super easy to play! It projects well acoustically so you can spend hours just noodling on the couch unplugged without even noticing, and 4.5 lbs (give or take) means that it won't break your back on a gig.

I would even recommend picking up a used Newark Street one from 2014-present just to get a feel for it. They are a fraction of the price, almost the exact same build, and they too are light weight and sound really killer for a MIK guitar. My 57' is woody and warm, and the Franz pickups break up in the best kind of way because they are low wound so you can crank the amp up to its sweet spot and the guitar can live right there without too much breakup. Or get the amp hot, and let your fingers create the dynamics! The ONLY downside is that it will feed back if turned up high enough as it is fully hollow. The MIK is very similar, but the lacquer finish and slightly brighter Franz reissue pickups are not as warm/woody/vintage sounding and it needs to be broken in a bit. I got around this by adding flat wounds and a wooden bridge similar to the ones from the 50's. Semi-flats will probably do the trick as well. Also the bridge on the new ones is pinned to the top unlike the vintage ones which float and can scratch the top if not handled properly. You can see the bridge wear on the top of my 57' for instance.

This is my 2015. I added Kluson vintage tuners with cream buttons (nothing wrong with stock tuners, just an aesthetic choice), a Guild ebony arch top bridge, and a toggle switch plate that matched the vibe. Its a killer guitar. Also for the record, the new ones have plastic inlays similar to a Rickenbacker. Oddly enough, there was an era of Aristocrats that had clouded plastic inlays in the 50's, my 57' is one of them! They tend to shrink and fall out over time, and you should always look to see if they were replaced (its a good thing if they were since it is an expensive job, but it technically decreases value - whatever that actually means in this Guild underworld). Im pretty sure most of the later 50's-early 60's models are all block pearl. Also, if you are seriously considering making the 5K purchase, make sure it comes with its original brown Lifton case as they are also valuable ($400-$500 ish)!

IMG_1835.jpg

@SFIV1967 Ralf I forgot about those! Wow, i remember trying them out somewhere before the Cordoba acquisition and not liking them at all. Maybe because there were a handful of vintage D-40's and D-55's next to them! I had no idea they released brand new models with the same script logo! My vintage one has a much better inlay in that it is an actual inlay and not a graphic, and I purposely sought out the script logo on this particular model as it is rare and rad. I hope the new Guilds are better that the ones from the 2010's era. My experience may have been a bit skewed.
Thank you for the reply!

It's nice to learn about the aristocrat and what to be cautious of before buying one!!
The new ones look stunning too and a couple of persons from LTG have already explained to me how good and interesting they are. I should consider buying one. I'll always dream about a vintage one but while waiting for the money to get saved I like your recommendation and they do seems like really good guitar.

I'm curious about what style of music do you play ? And do you use the vintage one primarily for studio recording and the new one for gigs ?
Thanks again for taking the time to answer !
Have a wonderful day,
Alexis Nootens
 

SFIV1967

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Thank you for the reply!

It's nice to learn about the aristocrat and what to be cautious of before buying one!!
The new ones look stunning too and a couple of persons from LTG have already explained to me how good and interesting they are. I should consider buying one. I'll always dream about a vintage one but while waiting for the money to get saved I like your recommendation and they do seems like really good guitar.

I'm curious about what style of music do you play ? And do you use the vintage one primarily for studio recording and the new one for gigs ?
Thanks again for taking the time to answer !
Have a wonderful day,
Alexis Nootens
I play a lot of RnB, Funk, Jazz, and Soul/Blues. They all really mesh together these days, and i have a pretty math driven fusion project right now called Extracredit. But i do pop gigs mainly in the RnB field with different artists around LA, and play for Booker T on and off.

The Aristocrat is killer for Jazz, Blues, and Soul. Not really a rock machine as it is single coil, hollow, and will get noisy and feedback on higher gain amp settings. The middle position on the toggle switch is really spanky and totally a cool James Brown kind of sound, the bridge is bright and breaks up really well with a hot amp and a heavy hand, and the neck pickup is pretty fat for a single coil, but has a bright side to it that can be tamed easily when you roll the tone off a little. Or you set your amp for the guitar and let it rip, i generally find that American 6L6 amps like the Franz pickups a bit better than EL84's (British - Vox specifically), at least for cleaner tones. But crank a AC15 with the bridge pickup and you are in tone heaven.

If you can snag a Newark Street one for $700 (USD) pick it up, you will not be disappointed. If anything you will be able to resell it for the same amount of money. But if you can find one at a vintage shop take it off the shelf and sit with it for a but, but i dare you to not fall in love :)
 

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I play a lot of RnB, Funk, Jazz, and Soul/Blues. They all really mesh together these days, and i have a pretty math driven fusion project right now called Extracredit. But i do pop gigs mainly in the RnB field with different artists around LA, and play for Booker T on and off.

The Aristocrat is killer for Jazz, Blues, and Soul. Not really a rock machine as it is single coil, hollow, and will get noisy and feedback on higher gain amp settings. The middle position on the toggle switch is really spanky and totally a cool James Brown kind of sound, the bridge is bright and breaks up really well with a hot amp and a heavy hand, and the neck pickup is pretty fat for a single coil, but has a bright side to it that can be tamed easily when you roll the tone off a little. Or you set your amp for the guitar and let it rip, i generally find that American 6L6 amps like the Franz pickups a bit better than EL84's (British - Vox specifically), at least for cleaner tones. But crank a AC15 with the bridge pickup and you are in tone heaven.

If you can snag a Newark Street one for $700 (USD) pick it up, you will not be disappointed. If anything you will be able to resell it for the same amount of money. But if you can find one at a vintage shop take it off the shelf and sit with it for a but, but i dare you to not fall in love :)
Thank you for your answer! It's always interesting to learn what genre of music people do and on what guitar. It also helps me understand the strengh of each model.

I agree about the aristocrat. A collector borrowed me one while I was rehearsing for a band before recording, I play mainly Jazz & Soul and I remember playing all the time on the neck pickup and the sound was mind blowing! Super warm! I played through an old gibson amp and I really was in heaven. I've been dreaming of buying one since..

I'll definitely follow your advice and buy a Newark one if I find one.
Thanks again for taking the time to answer!

PS : playing for Booker T !! Waouw !!!!! Impressive !! I've been listening to him since I'm a kid!!!!!!
 
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