NAD Thunderstar 1 x 12

mavuser

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a sudden burst of AAS to go along with my ongoing case of GAS has reuslted in this:

1969 Thunderstar 1x12

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jtg6.JPG


cnow.JPG


lsf4.jpg


quite possibly the very best amp I have ever heard in my life. was literally a shot in the dark (dark garage/driveway craigslist deal at 10 pm in jersey), turned out great!
 
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gilded

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Had one, great amp! Still have a spare speaker in storage somewhere. Does the vibrato work? Mine didn't!

Have fun! Harry
 

dapmdave

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Great looking example! Looks like there may be some valuable old tubes in there.
 

mavuser

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Harry, when I checked out the amp, it hadn't seen the light of day in a long long time. The reverb wasn't working. It saved me a few bucks on the price. Brought it home and warmed it up...everything works fantastic! Amp was used a little back in the 60s and from what I understand minimally in the 90s, but overall not much. The guy I bought it from, his grandfather bought his father the amp new in the 60s. The back panels have never been removed and everything sounds killer so I'm not touching it. Curious what speaker is in there but curiosity will wait.

dave, one of my first thoughts was the tubes and speaker are probably worth more than I paid for the whole thing. I had just mentioned that to default last night. They ain't goin anywhere though!

This was a total score.

Someone should grab the one in greenfield mass on CL!
 

mavuser

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Should warn u all too, there is a thunderbass amp also on my radar! It is BIG! And very unnecessary. But looks to be clean and complete, and one of the very last Guild pieces missing from my specific collection . Will see what happens on that. After that there a couple more guild guitars that interest me, but also one or 2 I own, that I may need to sell.
 

gilded

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You will be amazed when you open up the speaker cab.
I'd tell you but I don't want to spoil the fun!

When you open up the top chassis, do me a favor and tell
What the values are for the tremolo parts. Mine came with a missing LED/LDR or whatever it was and I wasn't able to
figure out what the right value was. If I knew what it was supposed to be, I'd
put the right parts back in the amp for the friend I gave it to.

Thanks, gilded
 

Default

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When you thump the pan on the side, do you here the reverb springs crashing?
 

The Guilds of Grot

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It looks a lot like mine except I believe mine has silver knobs!

AmpCover-002_zpsa7d04f0d.gif



You weren't lucky enough to get a cover with it were you?
 

mavuser

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When you thump the pan on the side, do you here the reverb springs crashing?
not in his garage but a nice slow cruise home on the bumpy cross Bronx expressway and cross island parkway got the springs bouncing just right! Then I brought it home and warmed it up for a half hour. All tubes burn bright and she sounds smooth.

Harry, what speaker is in there??? I think it's the 100 watt Jensen if I had to guess. I am not planning on removing the panels soon. If it ain't broke, don't fix it! Not much fun left to spoil, the sound of the speaker and everything else already blew my mind. Was just curious which one it is. Jensen Vibranto? As to the rest of your question, maybe Default, Grot, or C.S.T. (From this forum and the vintage guild tube amp FB page) can help?

Grot, nice cover! No dice here on that. I should get something for it though
 

Default

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Actually, I meant when it's on. If you thump on the side and you can hear a reverby rattle, the problem is before the reverb pan, which might be just a cable. If you thumb on the reverb driver ( the 6GW8 tube) and get noise through the speaker, the problem is somewhere before that tube. The 6GW8 is a dual tube. The pentode section drives the signal into the pan and the triode amplifies the 'verbed signal from the pan. It's kind of like having a Fender Reverb unit, but instead of plugging you guitar into the Reverb and plugging that into your amp, the Reverb unit is built right in. If you want to replace the pan in that, you would use an Ampeg replacement pan, not a Fender. The Ampeg/Guilds couple to the pan with a capacitor (1500 ohms input on the tank) while Fender uses a transformer which is 4-8 ohms. Use a Fender 4 ohm tank and you will shorten the life of your tube and 6GW8s are not in production and pricey.
 

mavuser

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There is no problem with the reverb or otherwise in Thunderstar, to this point. The reverb wasn't coming on in the guys driveway when I bought it, but since I've brought it home it is working flawlessly.

there is a "3 spring fender type accutronics" reverb pan in my maverick though. It sounds great but mega loud! I still have the original Guild pan but I've never heard it. I presume it works but not positive.

when my tech said "fender type" I do not know if he meant because it has 3 springs or If it is 4 ohms. Is there any way to tell? I know it has the 3 springs.
 

mavuser

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Steve, we have been through this before.
See your post (#8) of 9-20-2010 in the thread "maverick amp discussion"

"As the capn reminded me, the pan is driven by a transformer in this amp (maverick), so I mis-spoke."

guild keeps us in check!

I THINK the captn was saying in that thread, the wrong reverb pan simply wouldn't work at all, in that scenario. But I am the last person that would know. Very happy with the maverick and the Thunderstar both. The Mav has been worked on, has some stories to tell. Sounds like a Silvertone crossed with a fender vibrolux-super hybrid, or something. The Thunderstar plays "like new". Smoother than the Mav but still some edge. The reverb on the Thunderstar is way spaced out. The tremolo is like closer to a fender vibrato on the Thunderstar, "it will only go so slow". The Mav trem is in a class of its own. Still learning how to play the effect. I have one or 2 tunes/grooves I can use it for. Closer to like the Soldano Surf box or some other boutique like effect pedal. Both amps are monsters and have a tone unlike each other, or any other amp I've heard.

I did not realize how tremendous the Thunderatar was though. Was originally intersted in it to use for an on the go amp when jamming at friends' houses. i figured a 1x 12 was about the size of a fender deluxe or princeton. ha! maybe a super reverb or super 6 reverb! I almost didn't buy it, when I saw the size, but "common sense" set in, and I took it even when I thought the reverb was broken ;-

Steve thanks for all the help and info! U had some big shoes to fill and doing an amazing job. U are the only other person I know of with the Mav 2x10. And maybe Grot. I think main drag music told me they had one or 2 broken ones in the back of their shop, but I have never seen those.
 

gilded

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I don't remember what the speaker was, though it was not a Jensen or a Lansing. But it isn't the speaker that is trick, it's the design of the cabinet.

Do you know what a Fender Tone Ring is, or how it works? You used to see them on the old Fender Piggy Back Cabs. A tone ring has a wooden speaker board, with a metal ring that sits the speaker back about an inch from the board. In turn, the speaker ring sits on a different piece of wood attached to the main speaker board on two sides. The other sides are open and that lets all of the back-side speaker air content travel through the speaker hole right along with the front side air.

I'm sure the design was carefully thought out and was the product of much development back in the day. The hilarious thing is, a few years later, people started porting cabinets with various holes drilled into the speaker board and the sound is identical to the Tone Ring in blind-fold tests!

So, back to your cab.... it has an all-wood version of the Tone Ring, sort of a poor man's version of the metal Fender Tone Ring. Take out the back screws and see for yourself some time. Don't worry, it all goes back together just fine!

Again, please take some pics of the Vibrato components when you take the top chassis out. The existing schematic mentions them, but isn't specific as to what the parts are, which means that, 'you are my only hope, Obie Wan.' I want to find out what the parts are so I can re-do my old amp for the friend I gave the amp to a couple of years ago.

Have fun, gilded
 

mavuser

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When you open up the top chassis, do me a favor and tell
What the values are for the tremolo parts. Mine came with a missing LED/LDR or whatever it was and I wasn't able to
figure out what the right value was.

Does Grot have the answers?

I will ask a couple others that may know too. If mine must be opened up for investigation, that is ok, but I will need some assistance.
 

mavuser

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a size comparison. The Thunderstar is noticably taller and deeper than the Fender Super. The Thunderstar is also a sliver wider than the Fender. The Fender Super though, is significanlty heavier to lift and carry. Probably because of all the extra speakers. The Maverick is much smaller and lighter than the other 2 amps, moreso than it even appears in the picture. I used to consider the Maverick big (I thought the Thunderstar was small and i'd use it for travel, I was very wrong!) The Maverick though, would be be the tallest of the 3, if it had wheels.

Looking at this picture makes me wonder where Fender may have gotten the idea for its "silver face" line of amps, and sparkly grille cloth. hmmm.


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gilded

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Another thing about the thunderstar is that the single speaker sits up higher than you think in the cab, so it comes across as much louder than, say,
a Deluxe Reverb or a Princeton Rev. At least that's what the other guys in my band used to say. They heard it loud and clear!

Thunderstars aren't a lightweight amp, even if they are lighter than a Super!

In terms of opening it up, there is no big hurry. I gave my T-Star to a friend who liked Marshall sounds (you can get it with this amp, takes some dialing on the controls, though) and I'd just like to get it back to original spec if I could. I don't think it would ever sound as good Tremolo-wise as a Thunder 1 RVT, but I do know it should sound pretty good!

Have fun, Harry
 

mavuser

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speaker is coded CTS, early 1969. I editied the first post of this thread to add a couple pics. Gilded-hang in there, havnt removed the top chassis yet but this one, or possibly a diffrent Thunderstar 1x12, will likely get opened up in 2014.
 

mavuser

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I don't remember what the speaker was, though it was not a Jensen or a Lansing. But it isn't the speaker that is trick, it's the design of the cabinet.

Do you know what a Fender Tone Ring is, or how it works? You used to see them on the old Fender Piggy Back Cabs. A tone ring has a wooden speaker board, with a metal ring that sits the speaker back about an inch from the board. In turn, the speaker ring sits on a different piece of wood attached to the main speaker board on two sides. The other sides are open and that lets all of the back-side speaker air content travel through the speaker hole right along with the front side air.

I'm sure the design was carefully thought out and was the product of much development back in the day. The hilarious thing is, a few years later, people started porting cabinets with various holes drilled into the speaker board and the sound is identical to the Tone Ring in blind-fold tests!

So, back to your cab.... it has an all-wood version of the Tone Ring, sort of a poor man's version of the metal Fender Tone Ring. Take out the back screws and see for yourself some time. Don't worry, it all goes back together just fine!

Have fun, gilded

jtg6.JPG


cnow.JPG


here is a re-post of these 2 shots, a closer look at the tone ring Gilded describes, and the CTS date code.
 
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