Oxnard Serial Numbers

chazmo · May 8, 2016

Go to the following post in this thread to get the most recent information on the Oxnard serial numbers. What precedes it is some historical discussion as we gathered the info. -- chazmo

Oxnard Serial Numbers

I believe this practice makes the most sense, as the model # alone designates what Guitar it is in their line, so really, why not just use sequential numbering system regardless of model. Duplicates and a gappy list. If they leave a year code on there that'll help but it's a pretty minor...

letstalkguild.com

Neal said:
The label I saw had CA160003 on the first D-20 sold, I think.

Does someone have a picture of the label and any other serial number information?

Neal posted that in another thread, which implies that the 4 digits at the end of the serial number will be sequential production numbers from Oxnard. This would be a departure from the "Julian calendar date and number produced that day" that was used in Tacoma and New Hartford. Anyway, if anyone finds any supporting pictures and or documentation of the new serial numbering system for Oxnard Guilds, please post it here.

chazmo · May 9, 2016

Another comment worth tracking:

guildman63 said:
[ ... ] The format of the SN means nothing to me. Nor does the mention of California, but omission of Oxnard. [ ... ]

Hmm... My issue is that a sequential list, like what Guild used to have, gives you no insight into when the guitar was built/finished during the year. The flip side is that if you're interested in how many guitars were produced in a year (a question we always had in our minds with New Hartford), the sequential list is more likely to yield that answer.

Anyway, as Guild historians/aficionados/collectors, I think it's important stuff.

chazmo · May 9, 2016

More:

davismanLV said:
Why would anyone care which day and month a guitar was built during a year? Other than being obsessive about every little detail? Sometimes I think people want to know more about their guitars than actually matters in reality. A date stamp will usually give you a month and year. But the DAY of the month? How could that possibly matter? I'm all ears......

I think that's a good point, but I didn't state the problems with using a sequential list for serial numbers. Perhaps it isn't obvious, but the issue is that it's hard to keep a sequential list correct. You'll get duplicates (or, less important, gaps), or you'll get many cases where they won't give a guitar a serial number. All of those are serious problems for us collectors in the future.

snackyj · May 9, 2016

I do!:

http://i.imgur.com/pxvsEKy.jpg

It's C160006.

(I purchased the one from McCabes over the weekend and plan on uploading a YouTube video about it hopefully tonight.

I can make a new thread to not thread jack this one to answer any questions.)

snackyj · May 9, 2016

I do!... but of course I'm having trouble uploading it. :dispirited:

I don't want to thread jack, so I'll make a new thread later about the M-20, but I can say that the serial is on the inside of the M-20 is C160006. :smile:

fronobulax · May 9, 2016

snackyj said:
I do!... but of course I'm having trouble uploading it. :dispirited:

I don't want to thread jack, so I'll make a new thread later about the M-20, but I can say that the serial is on the inside of the M-20 is C160006. :smile:

Posting pics.

Based upon what we know and conjecture that makes it the sixth instrument made in Oxnard in 2016, right? A couple of folks have mentioned a "Certificate of Authenticity". Did you get one? If so, was it issued by Guild or the seller and did it mention the serial number or provide other interesting information?

snackyj · May 9, 2016

fronobulax said:
Posting pics.

Based upon what we know and conjecture that makes it the sixth instrument made in Oxnard in 2016, right? A couple of folks have mentioned a "Certificate of Authenticity". Did you get one? If so, was it issued by Guild or the seller and did it mention the serial number or provide other interesting information?

Yeah as far as I know. C - would be California, 16 for the year and then the four digit place holder 0000, for the models per year. It seems that mine is the 6th M-20 from the factory. The sales guy from McCabe's confirmed this and said that they got the M-20 and D-20 in stock because a former employee (from McCabe's) now works at Guild.

I do have a certificate of authenticity from Guild (it was in the case, in a little cloth bag), it basically has the Model, serial number and the inspector's signature all what appears to be hand signed.

When I get home I'll see if I can upload a pic of it.

chazmo · May 9, 2016

Regarding when serial number is assigned:

merlin6666 said:
So what's the practice at Cordoba?

Excellent question, Merlin. I'm not sure if anyone knows yet.

The process in New Hartford was to assign the serial number in final assembly. They kept the logbook in the stringing room, so it may be that that's when the labels were written and affixed (although I never saw that take place). That was the last step of the build in NH. In any case, I'm fairly certain it was final assembly. Cordoba could be a totally different proposition.

chazmo · May 9, 2016

By the way, I checked the guildguitars web site and they have not updated the "dating your Guild" document yet to talk about Oxnard. Maybe soon.

chazmo · May 9, 2016

snackyj said:
Yeah as far as I know. C - would be California, 16 for the year and then the four digit place holder 0000, for the models per year. It seems that mine is the 6th M-20 from the factory. The sales guy from McCabe's confirmed this and said that they got the M-20 and D-20 in stock because a former employee (from McCabe's) now works at Guild.

I do have a certificate of authenticity from Guild (it was in the case, in a little cloth bag), it basically has the Model, serial number and the inspector's signature all what appears to be hand signed.

When I get home I'll see if I can upload a pic of it.

Snackyj, I think it mans the 6th guitar, not the 6th M-20. But, I don't know for sure.

mavuser · May 9, 2016

chazmo · May 9, 2016

Oh, THAT's cool. My Ibanez has something like that. Mav, can you tell if that's a wooden plaque attached to the neck block or if it's actually branded onto the neck block.

mavuser · May 9, 2016

chazmo said:
Oh, THAT's cool. My Ibanez has something like that. Mav, can you tell if that's a wooden plaque attached to the neck block or if it's actually branded onto the neck block.

not sure, i am just looking at the same picture as you. it does look branded- but possibly into a wooden badge that is then glued to the neck block, as you suggest.

fronobulax · May 10, 2016

snackyj said:
It seems that mine is the 6th M-20 from the factory.

If the serial number is based upon a day count then the best we can say is the Xth guitar. We cannot say anything (based on the serial number alone) about how many of a model. If your guitar is really the 6th M60 then it is because they made (and assigned serial numbers) to no other models at the time your instrument was built. That is probably true but Cordoba is going to have to provide more information than the serial number to confirm it.

fronobulax · May 10, 2016

mavuser said:
not sure, i am just looking at the same picture as you. it does look branded- but possibly into a wooden badge that is then glued to the neck block, as you suggest.

I think the grain would look different if it were "stamped". I vote for a badge. From a process standpoint gluing on a badge later in the assembly process is probably cheaper/easier than stamping/burning something on to the neck before assembly or doing that through the soundhole. It should also be noted that the model is branded as well and that could be an issue if different models used the same neck. That was true in the electric world - the Starfire I and Starfire II bass (for example) were different models with the exact same neck.

kostask · May 10, 2016

This is a badge, based on the wood grain of the block itself and the badge being different, and also running in different directions. Badge looks to be mahogany or similar type wood (sapele, etc.) while the neck block itself doesn't.

chazmo · May 10, 2016

Yup, I think we all agree it looks like a plaque/badge. I hope it is affixed with adhesive, not velcro, just so we can hope for some permanence in this.

I should note that on my Ibanez, below, the plaque is glued to the top part of the neck block, below. Can't miss re: identifying this guitar. Much better system than a paper label, although arguably this is not really a permanent piece of the guitar. Pretty good solution though. There's no paper label even used / needed here:

Below, is the anchor for the neck, and it is covered by a piece of wood that is attached with velcro. This anchor lives beneath the plaque:

Below shows you the piece of wood that gets velcro'd back on to cover the anchor:

Neal · May 10, 2016

Here is how Huss & Dalton do it. The badge is screwed into the neck block.

BTW, all H&D's are numbered sequentially, regardless of model or year, exactly like the '70's Guilds.

merlin6666 · May 10, 2016

Ovation had more than a half million guitars built all sequentially numbered. Fortunately they seem to have kept track on when these numbers were used, so those who are interested at least can figure out the year that their guitar was built in:

http://www.ovationguitars.com/support/date-your-ovation

Westerly Wood · May 10, 2016

Neal said:
Here is how Huss & Dalton do it. The badge is screwed into the neck block.

BTW, all H&D's are numbered sequentially, regardless of model or year, exactly like the '70's Guilds.

I believe this practice makes the most sense, as the model # alone designates what Guitar it is in their line, so really, why not just use sequential numbering system regardless of model.

Oxnard Serial Numbers

chazmo

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