JS-II project

mmmalmberg

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I recently picked up a '71 JS-II. Has a funky paint job, sparkly sunburst over the original black. Not a bad idea but not well done. In fact was painted with most of the hardware in place. So, I'm going to refinish it if I can get through the poly-whatever is on there.

First thing I noticed when I pulled the pickups is, it's not a mahogany body. I thought they all were. Looks like maybe maple?

Also I haven't had a guitar apart for a while but I thought the truss rod extended through the neck with a nut accessible from the neck pickup cavity. This trussrod just dissappears in the neck somewhere - I guess this is typical? My only point of comparison is my matching, similar vintage S100.

Third question. This has the two stock humbuckers. I'm going to replace the neck pickup with a bisonic. Can I should I keep the same circuit?

Thanks for any suggestions! I'll post some pics when I get a chance...
 

mellowgerman

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As far as I remember, the truss channel did not extend into the neck pickup cavity on the JS-II that I used to own. Pretty sure it's standard for that to end before the heel of the neck. Also, I guess I assumed they were all mahogany as well. Will be interesting to find out differently, though with old Guilds it seems like nothing was ever really set in stone. Even though compared to a Fender the JS has a relatively small body, solid maple would still make that a relatively heavy bass, no?
The original circuit would be fine. I would just leave out the mini toggle switch. Good luck with the project and always looking forward to photos!
 

Happy Face

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I wonder about the wood as well. Mine is a bit head-heavy which would suggest it's not all mahogany?

Save yourself the effort and buy mine!
 

adorshki

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Also I haven't had a guitar apart for a while but I thought the truss rod extended through the neck with a nut accessible from the neck pickup cavity. This trussrod just dissappears in the neck somewhere - I guess this is typical? My only point of comparison is my matching, similar vintage S100.
I'm probably about to learn something here but isn't the adjustment nut accessible underneath the truss rod cover on the headstock?
 

Minnesota Flats

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I've never had a non-Fender guitar or bass with an adjustable truss rod that was accessed anywhere but under the cover on the headstock. There may be other exceptions to that rule, but I've never owned one of them.
 

adorshki

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That is where it is, on mine anyway.

Thanks guys.
It just occurred to me that just because it works that way on (USA built) Guild acoustics didn't mean it was the same on the electric side and I didn't remember ever seeing a specific reference.
 

mmmalmberg

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I wonder about the wood as well. Mine is a bit head-heavy which would suggest it's not all mahogany?

Save yourself the effort and buy mine!


I know, I should. But there it was sitting in my shop, and I just found myself pulling it apart and hitting the body with some sandpaper to see how hard the finish is. Unfortunately it's like polyurethane, doesn't sand well at all:) Ah well.

You would have noticed the wood when you replaced the pickups, it's white in mine. The mahogany is fairly dark. There are some pretty lightweight maples which is my guess but it could be birch or alder or something else. But I know my M85 was maple, although it was I think a heavier maple. Well, no idea I guess. I took some pics, will try to get them onto my computer to post.
 

mmmalmberg

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The original circuit would be fine. I would just leave out the mini toggle switch. Good luck with the project and always looking forward to photos!

Did the mini toggle switch relative phase between the pickups? Why would you leave it out? I see on this JSII it's absent, and this is the same pickup configuration I'm going to have, so just from that perspective I could see leaving it out, as Guild must not have thought it was maybe such a good idea with the combination of single and double coil pickups...
 

Happy Face

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I'm curious about the mini toggle switch you refer to.

BTW, I had a friend rewire the pickups in the M-85 to put them in phase with one another. I much prefer the sound now.
 

mmmalmberg

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Later on Guild built Pilot Basses from poplar. Very white, very light.



(Just throwin' it out there!)

It's a possibility, a bit white for poplar at least in my experience, but possible. Serial # dates it as 1971. My S100 is I think later and has a mahogany body so that seems odd. The weight feels like it could be something like poplar. But then too, there are lighter varieties of maple and other white woods.
 

mmmalmberg

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Can't find the pics I took; just downloaded these from the listing:
js2_0.jpg

js2_1.jpg

js2_2.jpg

js2_3.jpg

js2_4.jpg

js2_5.jpg

Fair enough pics, the paint job is more textured than shows in the images - not a lot but a bit. Not really a fan of the sparkled opaque sunburst. Not a bad job but I'd rather just black like it originally was, and as is my S100.
 

mmmalmberg

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js2_6.jpg


The wood feels harder than poplar, but then who knows how hard 45 year old poplar should be. The router burns in the corner make me think maybe maple. And the end grain looks maplish... But I could go either way I suppose.
 

mmmalmberg

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Plus, interesting how nicely they glued it up with alternating quartersawn directions. I think not likely to ever warp like that.
 

fronobulax

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Did the mini toggle switch relative phase between the pickups? Why would you leave it out? I see on this JSII it's absent, and this is the same pickup configuration I'm going to have, so just from that perspective I could see leaving it out, as Guild must not have thought it was maybe such a good idea with the combination of single and double coil pickups...

No. "suck switch" would be a good search term just in case I get lazy and don't tell you more than you want know. I speak with authority as the only owner of a '71 JS II.

On the basses the switch was a tone switch although when the companion guitars had a similar switch it was a phase switch. It was present from roughly 1967 through 1977 although not consistently. The circuit in the Starfires uses different electrical components than the JS although the effect is similar. In one position the tone is bassier and muddier. In the other it isn't. On the JS it was actually marketed as a "deep/hard" switch in case that gives a better sense of the sound.

Many Starfire owners have disabled the switch. On the Bisonic pickup it seems to kill the midrange which is what makes that pickup so special. The JS owners are more ambivalent. The Guild humbuckers are distinctive, and in some opinions limited, and the switch actually provides some sonic options on an otherwise limited bass.

There is a thread where someone bypassed the switch on a JS and found the results much more interesting.

That said, circa 1970 and circa 1977 there were JS basses produced that did not meet the factory spec. In particular the bass pictured here is a 1970 bass and has the Bisonic pickup, which is not spec. The absence of the switch probably has more to do with the difference in the circuit because of the pickup choice than anything else.

IMO the circuit might make sense on a JS with the Guild humbuckers but it probably not worth thinking about with any other pickup.

To your point on single vs double coil pickups - that is not really relevant because it is not a phase switch and it only effected the neck position pickup anyway.

:)

P.S. - Everything I say about Starfires should be understood to apply to Starfires circa 1967-1970 with factory Bisonics. I don't honestly recall much about the post 1970 humbucker equipped Starfires.
 
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mmmalmberg

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I could possibly do something different with that switch. I'm ambivalent about filling the hole in the body - those things can come back and haunt you, telegraph up through the finish etc. Maybe I can use it as a phase switch or maybe there's a way to wire the humbucker out of phase with itself, any ideas for it? Or really just get rid of it...?

I'm starting with a bass that already has the circuit and it's certainly more work to take it out than to keep it. If it really "sucks" I could just leave it off, assuming it's out of the circuit completely in the off position. If there's a benefit to actually removing it then I'd think about that. Or if there's a more interesting thing to do with it...

Lastly just wanted to say thanks for all the thoughts and input so far.
 

mavuser

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You can leave the Deep Hard switch and all the internals in this bass. the switch is not going to do anything if you dont engage it. and if you do, you may be happy with the results.

the "suck switch" in a 1960's Starfire bass with Hagstrom Bisonic pickups, and it's associated circuitry, is completely different. thats not what you have.
 

fronobulax

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I could possibly do something different with that switch. I'm ambivalent about filling the hole in the body - those things can come back and haunt you, telegraph up through the finish etc. Maybe I can use it as a phase switch or maybe there's a way to wire the humbucker out of phase with itself, any ideas for it? Or really just get rid of it...?

I'm starting with a bass that already has the circuit and it's certainly more work to take it out than to keep it. If it really "sucks" I could just leave it off, assuming it's out of the circuit completely in the off position. If there's a benefit to actually removing it then I'd think about that. Or if there's a more interesting thing to do with it...

Lastly just wanted to say thanks for all the thoughts and input so far.

If you are willing to wade through the posts I think http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...witch-to-a-phase-switch&highlight=suck+switch and http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...t-Deep-Hard-Switch-quot&highlight=suck+switch might address your questions.

FWIW my recollection of the circuit analysis is that the factory wiring always adds something to the circuit and it is just a question of what the effect is. It is really a toggle between a capacitor and a resistor and not an in/out or on/off kind of thing. The simple thing would be to unsolder it so it is no longer in the circuit.
 

mmmalmberg

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Thanks. Yeah I know some of them have some sort of inductor, which is not present here...
You can leave the Deep Hard switch and all the internals in this bass. the switch is not going to do anything if you dont engage it. and if you do, you may be happy with the results.

the "suck switch" in a 1960's Starfire bass with Hagstrom Bisonic pickups, and it's associated circuitry, is completely different. thats not what you have.
 
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