Overseas quality

AcornHouse

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I'm sure it has nothing to do with the factories the Guild imports are made in, but I saw, on FB, pics from a local music shop. Their repair guy had to do a bridge repair/reglue after the bridge came off. The reason the bridge came off? It had been glued to the finish on the soundboard; absolutely no wood to wood contact. Not surprisingly, the bridge took most of the finish underneath it with it when it came off.
 

dreadnut

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I have a Korean made DeArmond Starfire Special from 1999, the workmanship is impeccable. I just played it for a couple hours though my Crate Acoustic 125D, damn fine guitar.
 

bobouz

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One overseas factory that can build a guitar as good as anyone, bar none, is Terada in Japan.

I have three made by them (two electrics & one acoustic), and they simply ooze quality from every angle.
 

AcornHouse

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I wasn't saying ALL overseas builds are bad. I was noticing an aggregiously bad example.

JEFF, when the bridge is glued on after finishing (which is the usual method), the finish is removed where the bridge will be glued, or masked before hand. In this case, the bridge was glued onto the finish.
 

fronobulax

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I'm a little confused here, perhaps because I am not logged into Facebook. But what I can see are pictures of a bridge re-glue on a gorgeous blue finished acoustic that looks like nothing Guild has ever made overseas, to my knowledge.

So is this a Guild I don't know about? Is this suggesting that non-American factories have a lower rate of stupid mistakes getting past quality control? Is Sean someone we should invite to LTG because his comment that he sees this kind of thing, and most often from overseas factories, is unusual and insightful?

I learned at one of the LMGs that you are supposed to mask the finish or remove it before gluing the bridge on. When you don't then you have to re-glue it eventually. Someone working at New Hartford told stories of instruments where the mask was not quite right and handwork was required to remove the finish before gluing. Sometimes that didn't happen and they saw the instrument again.
 

AcornHouse

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I'm a little confused here, perhaps because I am not logged into Facebook. But what I can see are pictures of a bridge re-glue on a gorgeous blue finished acoustic that looks like nothing Guild has ever made overseas, to my knowledge.

So is this a Guild I don't know about? Is this suggesting that non-American factories have a lower rate of stupid mistakes getting past quality control? Is Sean someone we should invite to LTG because his comment that he sees this kind of thing, and most often from overseas factories, is unusual and insightful?

I learned at one of the LMGs that you are supposed to mask the finish or remove it before gluing the bridge on. When you don't then you have to re-glue it eventually. Someone working at New Hartford told stories of instruments where the mask was not quite right and handwork was required to remove the finish before gluing. Sometimes that didn't happen and they saw the instrument again.
Frono, as I said from the start, this is NOT a Guild. (In the luthier forum on FB, someone mentioned that it looks like a cheap Ibanez.) At the low end of the pool, this is not an uncommon occurance. If you can see the pics, then you seen in the first one that the bridge took the finish off and that it had not been masked off, but had been glued directly onto the finish; resulting in the inevitable coming off. On cheap guitars, they don't take the time (=$) to mask.

This was posted, as many postings we've seen, as an OMG moment of poor (again, NOT Guid) guitar-like object building coming out of the cheaper import factories.
 

bobouz

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I wasn't saying ALL overseas builds are bad. I was noticing an aggregiously bad example.

Yes, I know. I just wanted to give a little tip of the hat to an overseas builder that has been manufacturing very high quality instruments for decades. Terada is probably best know as the maker of Epiphone's Elitist line of electric hollowbodies & acoustics from about fifteen years ago. The only model still regularly available is the Elitist Casino, but occasionally they do special runs of other instruments.
 

Christopher Cozad

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...I learned at one of the LMGs that you are supposed to mask the finish...
For posterity, I suppose you meant to say, 'Mask the raw wood...'. (The masking would then be removed *after* the finish was applied, leaving an unfinished, raw wood surface to which the bridge would be glued.) As Chris mentioned, the alternative to masking the raw wood prior to applying the finish is to finish the entire surface and then rout or scrape off the finish beneath the (position of the) bridge (again, leaving a raw wood surface for proper adhesion).

If I interpret Chris' point correctly, as unacceptable as it would be to us to glue a bridge to a finished guitar, caveat emptor.
 

dreadnut

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I find it very interesting that U.S.-made guitars continue to command higher prices; I don't think it's just snob appeal, they're just better. The market prices bear this out.
 
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GAD

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I find it very interesting that U.S.-made guitars continue to command higher prices; I don't think it's just snob appeal, they're just better. The market prices bear this out.

I see NS S100s for $700 all the time. All those $1200 '90s S100s on Reverb and eBay just sit unless they're very special.

Completed auctions on eBay right now show an NS S100 sold for $699 and a '90s S100 for $710. The '90s S100 was +$100 shipping, but it also came with a real case while the NS came with a bag.

I agree 100% that they're just better guitars, but the market for selling guitars right now is terrible. Great time to buy, though!

Guild-S100-Completed.png
 

Jeff Haddad

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I wasn't saying ALL overseas builds are bad. I was noticing an aggregiously bad example.

JEFF, when the bridge is glued on after finishing (which is the usual method), the finish is removed where the bridge will be glued, or masked before hand. In this case, the bridge was glued onto the finish.

Chris, I deleted my post because I didn't want it to sound snarky...
I looked up some construction methods and agree with your assessment.

I am as much a USA-made snob as the next guy but I have some great Japanese-made Gretsch guitars and have had some Korean built guitars which were fine instruments. Some Mexican-made Fenders are very good guitars also. My experience is strictly with electrics.
 

dreadnut

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I guess I should have clarified my statement: BRAND NEW American made guitars command higher prices than their offshore counterparts.

To GAD's point, VINTAGE Guilds can be had for very good prices.
 

Quantum Strummer

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I guess I should have clarified my statement: BRAND NEW American made guitars command higher prices than their offshore counterparts.

I'd suggest this is mainly (if not entirely) because offshore production guitars are intended to sell at lower prices than US guitars. Companies taking advantage of lower wages and higher levels of automation. Also, major makers know "US made" has some cachet and so can allow for higher prices.

The two most expensive new guitars I've ever bought were made in Canada and Germany, respectively, by individual builders. In both cases the builder's skill and rep determined the price rather than where they were located.

-Dave-
 

richardp69

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This is a discussion with absolutely no right answers. There are some absolutely wonderful guitars, be they electric or acoustic, built in Japan, Korea, China etc. There's also really bad ones. But I don't think that's much different with made in the USA guitars. For the most part I've been happy but have also owned some real dogs as well.

I think you just find what works for you and play the hell out of it.
 

dreadnut

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Dave, I'm talking about "production" guitars, not boutique built by individual luthiers in low numbers. (I'm assuming your Canadian and German guitars were not high volume production guitars.)

American made guitars are to guitarists like Harleys are to bikers. A curious phenomenon. I love it; made in the U.S.A.!

Of course, a new Guild D-40 from Oxnard lists at $2,399...

I think a wise speculator would buy up a bunch of vintage American made Guilds while they are still such a bargain. The vintage Martins and even Gibsons are commanding much higher prices.
 

AcornHouse

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I think a wise speculator would buy up a bunch of vintage American made Guilds while they are still such a bargain. The vintage Martins and even Gibsons are commanding much higher prices.
GAD's doing his best!
 

bobouz

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This is a discussion with absolutely no right answers. There are some absolutely wonderful guitars, be they electric or acoustic, built in Japan, Korea, China etc. There's also really bad ones. But I don't think that's much different with made in the USA guitars. For the most part I've been happy but have also owned some real dogs as well.
Indeed. More than anything, contracted overseas production is geared towards the price point the buyer wants to hit. I mentioned Terada earlier because they can truly build whatever you want, including accurate reproductions that cost thousands. But more often, it's the entry or mid-point markets that pay the bills, so that's where the vast majority of the action is.
 

dbirchett

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Yes, I know. I just wanted to give a little tip of the hat to an overseas builder that has been manufacturing very high quality instruments for decades. Terada is probably best know as the maker of Epiphone's Elitist line of electric hollowbodies & acoustics from about fifteen years ago. The only model still regularly available is the Elitist Casino, but occasionally they do special runs of other instruments.

Actually, I think Terada is probably best known at this point for making the Gretsch Professional series. Great guitars. The Epiphones were/are great as well. Sorry they were discontinued.
 

bobouz

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Actually, I think Terada is probably best known at this point for making the Gretsch Professional series. Great guitars. The Epiphones were/are great as well. Sorry they were discontinued.

Thanks, good to know. With electrics, I've been pretty exclusively focused on Gibsons & those particular Epiphone models that were originally made in Kalamazoo by Gibson. Should take a look at the Gretsch's you mentioned!
 
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