Guitar Feels Stiff

jmascis

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Hey guys, I recently made a post sharing how I bought a NOS/Mint D-40 standard. It plays a bit stiff. I even down-tuned the strings to Eb to see if the strings might be the culprit. I figure at Eb the John Pearse strings (which are known for feeling stiff) would match D'Addarios. Plus they're .12s already so I'm not sure it's the strings.

Any suggestions?

My next thing will be to bring it to my luthier to see if the nut and saddle can come down a hair. Short of that, I'm not sure what to do. I like a more "slinky" feel, and when I bought it, I did feel it was stiff, but figured it was just new and the strings were the culprit or it needed minor setup adjustment to the nut. Now I'm not so sure. My theory it's that this particular guitar has a stiff neck and maybe the addi bracing adds to the stiffness?

I'm considering selling it now if anyone in the CA area is interested. I love the guitar in every way but the feel/stiffness. Tone and build are to die for so I'm bummed to even think this way. If I do decide to sell it, it's mint (perfect neck angle/geometry), so PM me with any offers and local people only. Right now I'm not selling it but might consider it within the next month if I can't get used to the feel. Any suggestions welcome!
 
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Rayk

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Different brands can have different tensions in the same gauge also done the string gauges can differ inbetween the said light 12's . What mean you might have 12 high E 54 low E but the b string might be a tad different between the JP and D'Addarios .

Photos of the action or string height at the 12th fret along with a pic of the nut will give was a better understanding slongvany other photos you could add .

The bracing/wood stiffness is as it's supposed to be we all hope :)
 

jmascis

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Different brands can have different tensions in the same gauge also done the string gauges can differ inbetween the said light 12's . What mean you might have 12 high E 54 low E but the b string might be a tad different between the JP and D'Addarios .

Photos of the action or string height at the 12th fret along with a pic of the nut will give was a better understanding slongvany other photos you could add .

The bracing/wood stiffness is as it's supposed to be we all hope :)

Thanks. So even down tuning the JP strings, you think DA strings could have a better effect? Here is a picture of the bridge height. I can take one of the nut soon.

http://i.imgur.com/ZFzVYQE.jpg

The action is about 2.4 to 2.5mm at the 12th fret on the saddle.

When I fret the 3rd string and depress the nut, there is some space. It's not much, but I was thinking it could maybe come down a hair. I'm not sure what effect lowering the saddle but not the nut would have.

Here are the photos I currently have of it: http://imgur.com/a/OVvyF
 
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txbumper57

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Hey Jmascis, Before you decide to sell it try the Daddario EJ16's on it. They feel completely different from the JP's and may solve your problem all together with just a string change. Also in your previous thread I posted a link on How to check and Set your Neck relief which will almost certainly need to be adjusted being that the guitar in question came from the factory with Medium gauge strings and you now have lights on it. Adding some relief to the neck can also have an effect on reducing the "Stiff" feel of the strings when tuned to tension. Just a few suggestions.

TX
 
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jmascis

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Hey Jmascis, Before you decide to sell it try the Daddario EJ16's on it. They feel completely different from the JP's and may solve your problem all together with just a string change. Also in your previous thread I posted a link on How to check and Set your Neck relief which will almost certainly need to be adjusted being that the guitar in question came from the factory with Medium gauge strings and you now have lights on it. Adding some relief to the neck can also have an effect on reducing the "Stiff" feel of the strings when tuned to tension. Just a few suggestions.

TX

Thanks, TX!

Yes, I definitely remember that post and plan to add the DA's when it's due for a string change (I hate to waste strings so I'm playing out the JPs). I put in one turn of relief, which I felt it needed, and the relief now seems pretty ideal.

I won't sell it for a month or so until I try the DAs and have the luthier see if the nut can safely be lowered any. My feeling is it's the nut.

I was more curious if anyone has encountered this type of "stiffness" in their Guilds and to ponder what it could be.

As to describing what I mean, as Richard asked, basically the best way to describe it is I can feel the tension in the strings. It's almost a feeling like the guitar is too long (intonation is perfect so it's not), but it has a tense/stretched feeling in the strings. If you google "why does my guitar feel stiff or tight" you can see others report this. It's a feel thing. The general consensus is string change or some guitars just feel this way.

I'm just a bit bummed. This guitar is amazing otherwise. When I change strings in a few weeks I hope it fixes it. Again, just curious to hear others experiences and if they've felt this, and if so what they think caused it and if it ever resolved.
 
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txbumper57

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You can lower the entire string nut but normally they lower each individual string slot to set each individual string height which is something your Luthier should be able to do without issue. I know you said you hate to "Waste Strings" but if the ones you have on it right now don't feel right to you and effect your ability to enjoy the guitar you are actually just wasting your time with the guitar over a $10 set of strings. Especially if it is to the point where you are considering selling the guitar. Heck I will send you a new set of Daddario EJ16's if need be. My advice is don't wait, If you are having issues right now then go ahead and change the strings. If that solves the problem then everything is great, if it doesn't you can try the string nut lowering but at the least you can cross the strings off of your list. At least you will know if you want to keep the guitar or not. If it doesn't work for you then you can go ahead and make preparations to sell it and move on to another. No need to drag things out and be unhappy throughout that time period. Just my opinion of course.

TX
 

Nuuska

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Hello

For checking the nut - I would try capo on first or second fret to test the feel of rest of the neck.
 

jmascis

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You can lower the entire string nut but normally they lower each individual string slot to set each individual string height which is something your Luthier should be able to do without issue. I know you said you hate to "Waste Strings" but if the ones you have on it right now don't feel right to you and effect your ability to enjoy the guitar you are actually just wasting your time with the guitar over a $10 set of strings. Especially if it is to the point where you are considering selling the guitar. Heck I will send you a new set of Daddario EJ16's if need be. My advice is don't wait, If you are having issues right now then go ahead and change the strings. If that solves the problem then everything is great, if it doesn't you can try the string nut lowering but at the least you can cross the strings off of your list. At least you will know if you want to keep the guitar or not. If it doesn't work for you then you can go ahead and make preparations to sell it and move on to another. No need to drag things out and be unhappy throughout that time period. Just my opinion of course.

TX

Good points, TX. Will change them soon.

Hello

For checking the nut - I would try capo on first or second fret to test the feel of rest of the neck.

Also a good point. So if I capo the first and it plays looser, the nut is too high?
 

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Correct. Normally, the nut is a bit high from the factory, so the player can have it adjusted to his/her liking.
 

chazmo

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jmascis,

I'd consider changing your mind about trying string sets on your guitar(s). Strings are the single most important variable in the tone / playability equation! Period! Frankly, in my opinion, you should *expect* to try different sets to find out what suits you when you buy a used guitar. You should also *expect* to get a guitar set up properly. Sure, try it on your own, but there's no point in moving forward if the guitar doesn't feel right.

Now, let me be clear, that's a different equation with different advice than when you're buying new, especially if we're talking about tone. As far as I'm concerned, I *never* recommend buying a new instrument unless you love it out-of-the-box. None of this "maybe it'll get less edgy with silk&steel" or "I think I'll love it when it opens up." And, playability... Don't buy it, period, if it doesn't fit right. That's my $0.02.
 
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TX and Chazmo are on-point! And, if the guitar doesn't play right, you're less likely to play it...so those strings will never wear out! LOL!
My guess is, you're really feeling that it's not just the strings, and you are delaying the disappointment! And you're probably right!

Do you have another acoustic guitar that feels great to you?
If so, take both to your luthier/tech (hopefully you have a real, experienced, factory-authorized professional). Show him what you like about the one that feels right...then play and show him what doesn't feel right on this new one. My guess is you need a real, thorough, PRO setup...with the right strings. And, yes, it'll cost a couple of $...but it's the best investment you can make for your guitar that you seem to love otherwise.
Changing strings will help...but you really need a set up.

Years ago, I had a guitar that was tough for me to figure out why it just didn't feel right.
Found out that someone at some point changed the nut and saddle, and one (or both) were the wrong radius for that particular guitar.
When they were swapped out, and the setup completed, it played like butter.

There have been other guitars that just kind of baffled me and Tx's info helped me immensely!
But all of the set up things need to be done in a particular order, and done right. And that means checking the fret levels too.

Strings can do a LOT...but they can only do so much.

If you're near L.A., I know a great Guild guy!
 

jmascis

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I'm near LA sort of, just a few hrs up the road. Who is the guy? Thanks, man!
 

davismanLV

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Hey bud, did you try the capo on like 2nd fret? And if so, how did that work for you? C'mon..... work with us, we're tryna help here..... :pirate:
 

jmascis

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Hey bud, did you try the capo on like 2nd fret? And if so, how did that work for you? C'mon..... work with us, we're tryna help here..... :pirate:

Not yet, but hopefully tonight when I get some practice time. Just been busy the past few days with little practice time. I will check it out as soon as I can.

We got a massive heatwave through CA (70 degree to 100 highs overnight) so just trying to keep all my guitars maintained as well right now. Part of the reason I haven't uncased it as well. Will do soon!
 
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JohnW63

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If I were to take a guess at what your feeling, that makes you think the guitar is stiff, I would guess it was how hard you need to press to get a clean note. Yes, string tension can play into that. Scale length can as well, but the most likely thing is that it is not setup for the way YOU play. I know a guy who plays loud, and is used to his Martin, which I feel has high action, but he flings his flat pick pretty hard and NEEDS higher action or he gets string buzz. I , on the other hand rarely play that way and prefer a lower, easier to play action, like my Ovation, the Walden I have, and all the electrics. My D-55 came with a pretty high saddle. The guy I know liked it just the way it was. For me, I thought I would get hand cramps, if I played barre chords too much. It also has mediums on it, and I am more used to lights. I had a new saddle made to bring the action down. I may have gone just a touch too low on the bass side of the saddle. We'll see.

Summary. Get thee to a GOOD guitar setup person ( luthier ) and if possible , bring a guitar that plays the way you like, so they can take measurements.
 

Bonneville88

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jmascis,

Been following this thread with interest... what kind of stuff do you typically play,
and are you more of a picker / strummer or more of a finger-picker?
Coming from more of an electric background or acoustic?

Asking as I'd like to know... feel
free to post a couple of links/ examples of what you're most likely to be playing on the new guitar.

I do mostly strumming and flat picking but I can get into some heavy duty finger-picking
as well - my D55 is a better flat picking guitar, my D25 is a better strumming / singing guitar,
the D30 and GF25 are better finger-picking guitars... my D55 is generally not enjoyable
for me to finger-pick... I might use your description of "stiff"!

Just sharing personal observations / experiences... looking forward to getting an
idea where you figured you'd be headed musically...
 

Taylor Martin Guild

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If it's the nut, the guitar will fill less stiff when you use a capo.
Try placing a capo on the first fret and see how the guitar feels.

It's my opinion that almost any guitar with a proper set up will play well.
If you have a guitar that plays the way you like, take it with you to the guitar tech and have the D-40 set up like that guitar.
 

jmascis

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jmascis,

Been following this thread with interest... what kind of stuff do you typically play,
and are you more of a picker / strummer or more of a finger-picker?
Coming from more of an electric background or acoustic?

Hey B!

So I strum and fingerpick. I also play guitar solos as if on an electric. This is when it feels most stiff, actually.
As a kid I mostly played electric but did have an acoustic (a yahama with high action that was very hard to play. I still have this guitar, and ironically if feels "looser" than the Guild for leads, but the bridge is leaning forward from time so maybe that's why).

I tried the capo last night, and it did feel a little better, so maybe the nut is a hair high. I can comfortably bar F chords, which is usually my test for the nut. But maybe it can still come down a bit. I will bring it to a luthier soon. I have it down-tuned a half step to Eb to help as well. Between that and the capo it felt pretty good. So I'm thinking a string change to DAs and lower the nut a hair.
 
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Neely Guitars. On Sunset Bl in Hollywood. Across the street from Guitar Center. David Neely is his name. Amazing guy! (323) 850-7043. Call him first for his hours and for how much he'll charge.
 
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