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Minnesota Flats

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"I wouldn't mind adding an old Epiphone Rivoli to the stable someday"

Other down sides of the Rivoli vs. SF:

Subjective:

•Rivoli is less elegant, both headstock and body, in appearance, IMHO

•Mudbucker vs. Bi-Sonic? Please...

Objective:

•Rivoli has one fewer frets (not that I actually care).

•Rivoli neck appears to be a hair wider than that of the SF. Haven't ever played one, so don't know if it's enough to give it a drastically different "feel" or not. I personally really like the SF's narrow neck/string spacing.

•Rivoli sports the infamous, Gibson 3-point bridge (though there are those who also find fault with the Guild bass "harp" bridge).


Don't mean to 'jack the thread, but OP did bring the Rivoli up.
 
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hieronymous

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mellowgerman - I've been meaning to say that I think your newly modded bass looks killer! I love Bi-Sonics, though I'm not convinced on the new ones - interested to hear your thoughts.

Also meant to ask - is the small knob the Varitone? Sounds like a cool package - definitely not stock!
 

mellowgerman

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Minesota Flats, I agree that the Starfire is superior to the Rivoli, but I have played a Rivoli, a few EB-2's, and one EB-2D. Each one of them was a bit heavier and less sleek than any Starfire I've ever played, but all were thoroughly enjoyable (except for one of the EB-2's which felt somehow cumbersome and had several dead-sounding notes across the fretboard). I think that for certain musical contexts it would nice to have one these brutes around though... one thing that comes to mind, back when I lived in Buffalo, I would get into some loud fuzzy psychedelic riffy jam sessions with certain friends. I just like the way a mudbucker sounds through a fuzzbox. My old modified Mustang bass comes to mind, which had a mudbucker in the neck and a bisonic in the middle. I would say that's the one weakness of a Bisonic, which sounds killer through an overdriven tube amp, but not so much through a really gnarly fuzz pedal. Also, the mudbucker has its own sort of charm when played palm-muted with a pick. Starfire with a pick is great too, but it's just a different sound.
In any case, there's no golden truth in this matter and it's all opinion-based. To each their own!

Hieronymous, thanks! So far I'm enjoying the sounds of the pickups blended. If I had to pick one or the other, I would say I am more of a neck pickup guy, but I do like to blend in a little bridge too, for which the Newark Street Bisonic is working just fine. On its own though, I would say it is a bit thinner sounding than the old 1966 SFB-I with the single pickup in the middle/bridge position that I used to own. In that general location though, I will say that my experimentation revealed that even 3/4" makes a big difference to the overall thickness of the tone, so the two-pickup bridge position being a tad closer to the bridge than the old middle/bridge/sweetspot position might also account for some slightly less low end coming through... Haven't had a ton of time with the new pickup though, since I have been in Germany without my bass for this last week. Will continue to report as time goes on though and plan to post some soundclips too. Stay tuned!
On a side note, if a Novak Bisonic, Hagstrom Bisonic, or Dark Star pops up used at a good price at some point, I'll definitely try and scoop it up to do a little compare and contrast tone experimentation.
And the small black knob is currently just a volume for the bridge pickup. It is wired V-V-T, more or less like a jazz bass but with a bit of a custom capacitor/resistor/inductor tone control, taken from my favorite position on the varitone I had on the bass previously.
 
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mikbass

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Wow, I think it looks super, somewhat heavier w the bridge pickup but at the same time sleek w only the two knobs.
And I must say I admire your bravery. I hope, and think, it sounds fantastic.
 

mellowgerman

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Wow, I think it looks super, somewhat heavier w the bridge pickup but at the same time sleek w only the two knobs.
And I must say I admire your bravery. I hope, and think, it sounds fantastic.

Danke, thanks, and gracias! I agree that from an angle the bridge pickup looks a little heavy due to the pickup mounting ring. I removed the original from under the neck pickup because it put the face of the pickup almost level with the frets, resulting in harsh clank sounds whenever I would dig in a bit. I do plan to make a thin one out of a black acoustic guitar pickguard blank to go under the neck pickup, just to even things out visually
 

mikbass

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Oh, my idea of heavier in this case was merely a look. Looks like it could do anything.
Heavier as in cooler. I'm truly looking forward to sound samples.
 

mellowgerman

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Oh, my idea of heavier in this case was merely a look. Looks like it could do anything.
Heavier as in cooler. I'm truly looking forward to sound samples.

Gotcha! Yes, it's surely more versatile now. And though there's also something aesthetically pleasing about the minimalist look of a single pickup configuration, when I see two bisonics next to each other in the standard Guild spacing, I definitely experience some kind of dopamine release somewhere at the core of my noggin... again, probably from years of drooling over pictures of vintage Starfire II basses!
 

Minnesota Flats

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I have both an NS-I and an NS-II. It is nice to have the added tonal range of a neck pup and yes: what could be mo bettah than ONE Bi-Sonic? Why, TWO, of course!

I play them both but also appreciate the simplicity of the one-pup/two-knob arrangement. And even while I'm playing the SF-II, I tend to lean towards selecting the bridge pup by itself.
 

mellowgerman

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So here's a quick demo clip I recorded this morning

https://soundcloud.com/mellowgerman/starfire-pickups-demo

Obligatory disclaimer: this will only give you a good idea of the full tones demonstrated if you play it through good speakers or headphones.

copied from demo's info tab:

"1970 Guild Starfire I bass w/ original Hagstrom Bisonic in neck position and added Guild "Newark Street" reissue Bisonic pickup. 5 snippets total, each demonstrating possible tones, blending in between pickups.
First is neck pickup solo'd.
Second is both pickups on full.
Third is bridge only.
Fourth is both; neck on full with the bridge cut back a bit.
Fifth is both; bridge on full with the neck cut back a bit."

Tons of great tone from this bass and these pickups, but if I had to pick one, my favorite combo would probably be #4 (neck on full, bridge around 85ish%).

What do you guys think?
 
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Happy Face

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You should be pleased how full the bass sounds all he way up the fretboard. Nicely done!
 

mellowgerman

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Where's the like button? Great job!

1YsZxtm.png
 

lungimsam

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Most II's I have seen pics of have the neck pup butted against the fingerboard end. Yours looks further away or is it just cuz you removed that black riser frame/base/bezel?
Also can you tell us how you measured and marked off where to rout the bridge pup? Or was it by eye?
 

thornev

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Sounds oh so nice. Makes me want to go find a 60's project SF and put all sorts of fun stuff in it.
 

lungimsam

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I might add a neck pup to my NSSFI and do MV/Blend/Tonestyler.
 
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