2018 Guild M-20 vs. 1965 M-20

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My first post after lurking here for some time.

In researching my latest guitar purchase, I couldn't find a specific comparison like this, so here goes.

I have a 1965 M-20 that I bought new for $105, if memory serves. It's been a lifelong friend.
However, it IS 50 years old. The top is bowing up near the bridge, the bridge is starting to come loose, and the pick guard is loose. My local repair guy really didn't think it was worth another rebuild (it was refurbished by Guild on R.I. in the mid-70s and had some bracing re-glued in the 1990s). So I started shopping and, of course, fell in love with reviews of the NEW M-20.
I now own both.

Visual comparison:
The main difference is the neck width (1 3/4 new vs. 1 11/16 old). I actually measured the top thickness with a micrometer, and they are identical.
The grain on the old mahogany seems a lot closer/tighter. The new mahogany is a lot lighter in color.
The 2018 model has extra bracing on the bridge side of the hole and on both sides of the hole. Probably wise, since that's where mine is deforming.
The body-to-neck joint is beefier on the new one, though I've never had any issue there.
The new one FEELS heavier, though I'd need a fish scale to tell the difference.

Sound comparison:
I tried a Martin 000-15M at Guitar Center and was not overwhelmed. My brother gave me a pep talk, saying, "EVERYBODY has a Taylor or a Martin. Get another Guild."
I'm glad I did.
The new one has a very clear sound, from highs to lows (I restrung it with Martin extra lights 0.010; it comes with 0.012). My wife really likes it.
The wider neck actually is a blessing for a fat-fingered guy like me, though I was worried. (My other main guitar also is '60s vintage and has a thin neck.)
The old one ... well, it's so subjective. But it's "lovely." Not as loud, not as twangy, not as good at projecting bass. Just lovely. Of course, that could be because we've been together for 50 years and I know how to play around its flaws.

Here's a short video comparison:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHaly3uUUzA

I wish I could have the 1965 version in tip-top shape, but lacking that, the new M-20 is a great guitar.

Thanks. Hope this helps anyone considering the purchase of one.
 

tommym

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Thanks for the review!

Currently, the M-20 / M-40 are the only new Guilds that interest me due to the wider 1 3/4" nut and 2 1/4" string spacing at the bridge. Can't quite handle the older narrower vintage Guild specs any more. Bummer.

Tommy
 

richardp69

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I also have an Oxnard built M 20. Although I'm a Dread and Jumbo kinda guy, this new M 20 is superb and I am more than happy with it. Great for taking out when I have s new song idea and I'm trying to type it out on the computer. I know there's been some concern/doubt about the Oxnard builds but personally???? I'm pretty impressed. The Oxnard F 40 has quickly turned into one of my all-time favorite brands regardless of manufacturer.
 

Westerly Wood

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"I have a 1965 M-20 that I bought new for $105, if memory serves. It's been a lifelong friend."

Awesome! Welcome to the LTG!
 

Br1ck

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Get a new guitar tech. Anyone who gives you the not worth fixing line knowing your history with it has no soul, and shouldn't be let near your 65.
 
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Get a new guitar tech. Anyone who gives you the not worth fixing line knowing your history with it has no soul, and shouldn't be let near your 65.

Awww, now you're gonna make me cry.

He said the problem is the bracing has warped with the top (there's only one small place where they've separated), so he thinks the whole top would need to be removed, somehow returned to near normal flatness (I have no idea how that would be done) and re-braced.

Technically, he was willing to try. I guess it was me saying it wasn't worth it. I need to sleep on it and decided whether to pay somebody to tackle that or sell it to somebody who wants to try. :)
 

TBK711

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Cool comparison. Thanks. I would be pleased to own either guitar!
 

CosmicArkie

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Welcome.

I'll give you your money back on that old beater.....:encouragement:
 

marius

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Thanks for the A/B.

Listening through cheap computer speakers I'd say I prefer the '65 strummed but the '18 flat picked. I'll have to give it a listen with good headphones tomorrow.
 

beecee

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Get a new guitar tech. Anyone who gives you the not worth fixing line knowing your history with it has no soul, and shouldn't be let near your 65.

+1. What a maroon!

I'll give you your money back on that old beater.....

I'll double that offer!
 

mellowgerman

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Very cool. Love seeing these comparison videos, especially when done by somebody with a personal connection to the instruments!
They both sound excellent in their own right, but I'll agree with Marius; strumming sounds perfect on the mellow '65 and flatpicking sounds perfect on the 2018.
Welcome and thanks for sharing!
 

chazmo

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Mark, welcome aboard, and I think it's fascinating that you've got the 50+ year spread going on to make comparisons. Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us.

I have to say, most of us really treasure the old Guilds so folks' reactions here are not surprising to me. As far as restoring the oldie, that is a tough call. As you know, your guitar can be repaired to fully playable standards, but it probably doesn't make financial sense to do it. That said, clearly there's a lot of emotional investment that needs to be considered too. Anyway, best of luck on whatever you decide to do, and, again, welcome aboard!
 

GuildFS4612CE

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surprised no one has suggested sending pics and email to Tom Jacobs in Florida, 'fixit' on this forum, for an opinion...in case the OP isn't familiar, Tom used to work for Guild and many forum members have sent him guitars to be worked on and report that he is very good and has very fair prices...with all your years with that guitar, it doesn't cost anything to get another opinion.
 

chazmo

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Jane that's a good idea. Tom Jacobs would certainly provide an estimate that you could take to the bank provided the interior bracing problems could be seen in pix.

One of the problems lately though is that doing the work anywhere but locally requires shipping which has gone up steeply lately. Sadly, an M-20 is just not a reasonable financial investment (assuming we're talking about taking the top off the soundboard and repairing it)... It just won't work.
 

Br1ck

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You should see some of the old Regals Jerry Rosa has fixed on his You Tube channel, Rosa String Works, that were someone's grandfather's guitar. Jerry Rosa's repair videos are amazing and his explanations are clear and detailed. He really gets an emotional attachment to an instrument.
 

adorshki

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Jane that's a good idea. Tom Jacobs would certainly provide an estimate that you could take to the bank provided the interior bracing problems could be seen in pix.
One of the problems lately though is that doing the work anywhere but locally requires shipping which has gone up steeply lately. Sadly, an M-20 is just not a reasonable financial investment (assuming we're talking about taking the top off the soundboard and repairing it)... It just won't work.
Shipping box at UPS store: $10.00
Amazon Prime annual membership: $99.00
Keeping your first love 1965 M20 alive for another 20 years or more: priceless.
:friendly_wink:
 

chazmo

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Shipping box at UPS store: $10.00
Amazon Prime annual membership: $99.00
Keeping your first love 1965 M20 alive for another 20 years or more: priceless.
:friendly_wink:
Yeah, no argument about the emotional part of this, Al.

BTW, there's no way that all the packing material comes in under $20 if you're buying popcorn or bubble wrap and boxes. Of course, if you already have the stuff from trading guitars... it's free.
 

adorshki

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Yeah, no argument about the emotional part of this, Al.
Hey I'll even make allowances for GAD owners to get attached to their instruments....
BTW, there's no way that all the packing material comes in under $20 if you're buying popcorn or bubble wrap and boxes.
Oh yah, that was just for the box.
And primarily to corroborate your comment about rising shipping costs, which have some very real reasons I described elsewhere a recently.
And to reassure Mark that we do understand why it's a tough call when it comes to a beloved piece.


Which reminds me:
Welcome aboard, Mark!
Awww, now you're gonna make me cry.....
That's good.
Don't try to hold it in, it's poison.
Try to imagine how DavismanLV felt when he woke up to discover he'd been sleepwalking under the influence of Ambien and trashed the top of his D65s :
http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...I-ve-already-contacted-Fixit&highlight=ambien
There.
Don't you feel much better now, in comparison?

He said the problem is the bracing has warped with the top (there's only one small place where they've separated), so he thinks the whole top would need to be removed, somehow returned to near normal flatness (I have no idea how that would be done) and re-braced.
There would be a lot of steam involved. It softens the hideglue to allow the top to come off, and I'm guessing the braces will follow.
There'd probably be more steam applied to the top itself to help it get its shape back, and the braces might need a bit of re-shaping to conform perfectly again, when re-glued.
This might be a good time to re-think that frame-off restoration of your '65 Mustang.
This'll be the guitar equivalent, and likely just as costly.
The real ugly part is how does the top come off without removing the fretboard extension?
Answer: I don't think it does, and parental discretion is advised before allowing young audiences to see that particular scene.
Finally after all that you'll probably want to touch up the NCL finish to at least deal with all the places it was separated to perform the repair.
And if anybody's qualified for that, Fixit is.
Courage.
Nobody ever said saving a marriage was gonna be easy.
And this is probably still cheaper than counseling.
The good thing is that this is all entirely possible.
We have the technology.
Technically, he was willing to try. I guess it was me saying it wasn't worth it. I need to sleep on it and decided whether to pay somebody to tackle that or sell it to somebody who wants to try. :)
Yep, y'just gotta get yer priorities straight, and we're always happy to help new members figure out how to spend their money.
Hope that helps.
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:glee:
 
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aamapes

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My vote goes to the old one. Perhaps the grandson will get there with another 20 years of playing. A rebuild may not make financial sense, but playing sense is another thing...
 
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