A Starfire IV Question

[dapmdave]

Some of you may already know that I'm in the process of swapping my '73 Starfire 4 for a '69 Starfire IV. I've been looking for the opportunity to do this ever since I fell in love with the sound of the smaller 60's humbuckers.

I have a question regarding the pick guard:

Now, I think the "stairstep" is right, and the Guild star, too. But why is there no hole for the adjusting screw for the bridge pickup? Closest I can find to this is on page 98 of Hans' book. And that one has a hole for the adjusting screw. It's not a big deal to me, but I wondering if this was a replacement pickguard.

And my gosh this guitar sounds nice. Playing this though the deluxe reverb is a time machine to the 60's.

Dave :?:

 

[kakerlak]

Some of you may already know that I'm in the process of swapping my '73 Starfire 4 for a '69 Starfire IV. I've been looking for the opportunity to do this ever since I fell in love with the sound of the smaller 60's humbuckers.

I have a question regarding the pick guard:

Now, I think the "stairstep" is right, and the Guild star, too. But why is there no hole for the adjusting screw for the bridge pickup? And is the pickguard too long? Seems like most I've seen of this style end halfway down the side of the pickup, where this one goes all the way down, more like a later one. It's not a big deal to me, but I wondering if this was a replacement pickguard.

Dave :?:

The no height adjust notch is correct for the smaller pickup ones, as far as I know. (my '66 SF is that way) Can't recall length off hand. It wouldn't surprise me if the overall pickguard outline was the same from mid 60s-70s and that just the position and size of cutouts for pickups changed. If so, the older Starfires, w/ the neck joined further into the body would have had more pickguard ahead of the pickups than the later Starfires, like yours. If that's the case, the small pickups, long neck late 60s models would have the most pickguard past the treble pcikup, as they'd have the long neck, with pickguard starting closer to the neck pickup, and smaller pickups, with the treble pickup bezel ending farther from the bridge (I think*). *I'm not sure how pickup placement varies b/w small and large humbuckers, there may just be more space b/w the smaller ones, and no diff b/w edge of pickup and neck and edge of pickup and bridge.

 

[jthrel]

Hello Dave,

Your Starfire pickguard matches my '69 Starfire XII pickguard. Browse the pics at http://letstalkguild.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=28508. No hole for the bridge pickup adjusting screw and the length of the pickguard extends past the bridge humbucker. There is a closeup of the bridge near the bottom of the post that shows this well.

Nice looking SF!

Al

 

[dapmdave]

Thanks to both of you for the replies. I feel pretty good about that pg now.

And that amber SF-XII is awesome, by the way!

Dave

 

[SFIV1967]

Dave,
yours seem to be a Starfire XII pickguard...

The 1965/1966 pickguard for the Starfire IV with 16th fret neck to body joint looked different due to the pickup positions:

Now looking at a 1971 with the new larger pickups there we have what you were looking for:

Ralf

 

[bluesypicky]

I've been looking for the opportunity to do this ever since I fell in love with the sound of the smaller 60's humbuckers. Dave :?:

... and would a not so distant musical collaboration project with Tom and I have anything to do with it by any chance?.... :lol:

Funny.... when I received my 66 (nod to the Treemster), I asked myself the very same question.
And if you look at my pic below, you'll see that the pick guard design isn't going quite as far as yours by the bridge pickup side, but just far enough to cover the adjusting screw!!!
Ahhh... the 60's and its cannabis culture.... all the way through guitar designers. :lol:

Glad you're enjoying yours too now..... BTW, did I miss the NGD pics?! :shock:

 

[SFIV1967]

And if you look at my pic below, you'll see that the pick guard design isn't going quite as far as yours by the bridge pickup side, but just far enough to cover the adjusting screw!!!
Ahhh... the 60's and its cannabis culture.... all the way through guitar designers. :lol:

Pascal: Because you got an earlier 1966 with 16th fret body joint and Dave a 1969 with 18th fret body joint! Your pickups are at a different position than the later 1966 and onwards models. See my post two posts above which explains it! I don't know exactly when it was changed, I only can say that I saw S/N EL-830 with 18th fret already whereas EL-780 still had 16th fret. And both are later 1966 serial numbers.
Ralf

 

[bluesypicky]

And if you look at my pic below, you'll see that the pick guard design isn't going quite as far as yours by the bridge pickup side, but just far enough to cover the adjusting screw!!!
Ahhh... the 60's and its cannabis culture.... all the way through guitar designers. :lol:

Pascal: Because you got an earlier 1966 with 16th fret body joint and Dave a 1969 with 18th fret body joint! Your pickups are at a different position than the later 1966 and onwards models. See my post two posts above which explains it! I don't know exactly when it was changed, I only can say that I saw S/N EL-830 with 18th fret already whereas EL-780 still had 17th fret. And both are later 1966 serial numbers.
Ralf

Yep, you sure explained it good Ralf.
Guess they stopped smoking at the design table in 1971, when the notch appeared over the screw.... :lol:

 

[SFIV1967]

But Pascal, you actually pointed me to another mystery now! Look at the neck pickup position! In your model there is also no cutout for the neck pickup screw there either! My one and Dave's have at least the cutout in the neck pickup pickguard position! So that was another change end of 1966! So it took them two design steps until they had both notches in it! So funny!
Ralf

 

[bluesypicky]

But Pascal, you actually pointed me to another mystery now! Look at the neck pickup position! In your model there is also no cutout for the neck pickup screw there either! My one and Dave's have at least the cutout in the neck pickup pickguard position! So that was another change end of 1966! So it took them two design steps until they had both notches in it! So funny! Ralf

Absolutely correct as usual... let me check my serial number for the pending investigation.... :mrgreen: EL334!
So my take on this is they quit smoking on a two step program: First step was when the first notch appeared, second step, the second notch.
Guess they were going full steam when they designed mine! :lol: :lol:
I actually have to loosen the PG (as I already did) to adjust pups height.... :roll:

 

[dapmdave]

I've been looking for the opportunity to do this ever since I fell in love with the sound of the smaller 60's humbuckers. Dave :?:

... and would a not so distant musical collaboration project with Tom and I have anything to do with it by any chance?.... :lol:

Funny.... when I received my 66 (nod to the Treemster), I asked myself the very same question.
And if you look at my pic below, you'll see that the pick guard design isn't going quite as far as yours by the bridge pickup side, but just far enough to cover the adjusting screw!!!
Ahhh... the 60's and its cannabis culture.... all the way through guitar designers. :lol:

Glad you're enjoying yours too now..... BTW, did I miss the NGD pics?! :shock:

Nope, no pictures, yet. Although there are a few other locations on the web where this guitar has been displayed:

Here's one: http://www.gbase.com/gear/guild-star-fi ... 9-sunburst

I have not completely finalized on this, yet. So don't want to make the NGD post prematurely, you know.

And you are correct about my developing a preference for the small humbuckers after playing and hearing yours and Tom's.

Dave 8) :roll: