High E string on S-100 keeps pulling off!

[riachuelo]

Greetings. I recently came into a 1972 S-100 and absolutely love the guitar. But I have a minor issue with the saddle on the first string, the high E. I don’t use a pick and on upstrokes I am used to sorta grabbing the strings a little. On this guitar, as a result, I sometimes yank the string off the saddle (pic below). In the past I almost exclusively played Teles, which need a little more rasslin’ with than this guitar does. Obviously, I can learn to be more gentle with the Guild. BUT, I am also wondering what I might do in terms of the setup to help that string stay put! I have tried raising the action a little to create more tension, but it didn’t make much of a difference. Anyone had this problem before? Anyone know of a smart fix? Thanks.

 

[GAD]

What strings?

I'm afraid the only solution might be to send me the guitar.

 

[riachuelo]

Sure! Just send me all yours in exchange!

 

[mushroom]

Hello.

Well I have had a fair few guitars with this kind of bridge and played pretty heavy at times with a pick and not had that happen.

Maybe try a heavier gauge string (or strings)?

I also wouldn’t mind seeing a photo of the whole instrument either.

I’m sure others will have further suggestions.

 

[lungimsam]

Do you have the slanted stop bar or a whammy tailpiece?

 

[riachuelo]

Do you have the slanted stop bar or a whammy tailpiece?

It’s the fixed, slanted tailpiece.

 

[riachuelo]

Hello.

Well I have had a fair few guitars with this kind of bridge and played pretty heavy at times with a pick and not had that happen.

Maybe try a heavier gauge string (or strings)?

I also wouldn’t mind seeing a photo of the whole instrument either.

I’m sure others will have further suggestions.

Here are pics of the whole guitar and another closeup, tailpiece included.

 

[GGJaguar]

Can you take a pic from the side, like this, so we can see the break angle over the saddles? That would be helpful.

 

[riachuelo]

Can you take a pic from the side, like this, so we can see the break angle over the saddles? That would be helpful.

Here are a couple of shots. It’s a tough angle to get from a fully flat perspective. Eyeballing it, though, it does seem that the break angle on the E is less acute than on the other strings. I may just try a shim of some sort under that saddle.

 

[hearth_man]

With the S-100 guitar the tail piece sits further away from the bridge than is the case on most solid body Guilds. This creates less of an string angle, break angle, over the bridge saddle and less force against the bridge to keep the string in place.

The suggestion of heavier strings would help. The other thing I noticed is that the high E string saddle is adjusted as far toward the neck as it will go. I am curious if your intonation is off on that string. That saddle is normally closer to the neck but that seems too close.

If the intonation is off, too sharp at the 12th fret. Then by moving the saddle back away from the neck a bit may put it in tune with the additional benefit of increasing the break angle and holding the string down a bit better.

Just a thought.

 

[riachuelo]

With the S-100 guitar the tail piece sits further away from the bridge than is the case on most solid body Guilds. This creates less of an string angle, break angle, over the bridge saddle and less force against the bridge to keep the string in place.

The suggestion of heavier strings would help. The other thing I noticed is that the high E string saddle is adjusted as far toward the neck as it will go. I am curious if your intonation is off on that string. That saddle is normally closer to the neck but that seems too close.

If the intonation is off, too sharp at the 12th fret. Then by moving the saddle back away from the neck a bit may put it in tune with the additional benefit of increasing the break angle and holding the string down a bit better.

Just a thought.

Thanks much. I was doing just that! Am going to see if it holds!

 

[chazmo]

Another idea... Keep in mind that I don't know squat about these bridges... Looking at the close-up picture, it looks like the grooved saddle is threaded onto something that is "screw-like." Perhaps you can adjust that so the saddle is closer to the block (which the screw seems to come out of)? Just a thought.

 

[Prince of Darkness]

Another idea... Keep in mind that I don't know squat about these bridges... Looking at the close-up picture, it looks like the grooved saddle is threaded onto something that is "screw-like." Perhaps you can adjust that so the saddle is closer to the block (which the screw seems to come out of)? Just a thought.

You're exactly right, this type of bridge has individual sideways adjustment for the strings. Just a matter of popping the string off the saddle and turning it to reach the desired alignment then popping the string back on. These bridges were standard on quite a few models during the 1970's

 

[GGJaguar]

These bridges were standard on quite a few models during the 1970's

And through the 1980s into the early 1990s. My 1992 Starfire 4 uses this bridge.

 

[chazmo]

You're exactly right, this type of bridge has individual sideways adjustment for the strings. Just a matter of popping the string off the saddle and turning it to reach the desired alignment then popping the string back on. These bridges were standard on quite a few models during the 1970's

Cool, PoD. Another thought is bridge height... Are these adjustable on the S100, and if the bridge height is raised wouldn't that increase the break angle? Of course, if it messes up the set-up to do that, then that's not a good idea.

 

[lungimsam]

How flat is the neck relief? If too bent, you could flatten the neck relief more, which lowers the action, then raise the saddle, causing even more break angle.

 

[Prince of Darkness]

Cool, PoD. Another thought is bridge height... Are these adjustable on the S100, and if the bridge height is raised wouldn't that increase the break angle? Of course, if it messes up the set-up to do that, then that's not a good idea.

Height adjustment is the same as for a tune o' matic (as is the intonation) and yes raising the bridge does also increase the break angle.

 

[Nuuska]

Hello

It has been few decades since I had a bridge like that. I can think of one solution - if you have access to metal workshop w lathe.

You can turn - or have someone do it - a new roller, that has slightly different slot shape - as I illustrated in my sloppy picture.

 

[riachuelo]

Hello

It has been few decades since I had a bridge like that. I can think of one solution - if you have access to metal workshop w lathe.

You can turn - or have someone do it - a new roller, that has slightly different slot shape - as I illustrated in my sloppy picture.

Cool idea! I don’t have a metal shop, though, so I’m gonna start with some of the adjustments suggested above. Thanks all for the help!

 

[Muckman]

A rubber grommet between the B and E string right behind the saddles could help keep it from moving that direction when lifted.....possibly a piece of spring wire bent to work as a retainer over the string, using the B string or saddle and the bridge bolt for anchoring...?