JLD Bridge System for my 76 F50R NT?

[2Tone]

First of all, I should be able to get pictures up next weekend
So I have been reading about the JLD bridge system and it sounds like a worth while investment simply because it appears to stabilize the bridge. I also checked the top of my guitar with a 12" machinist’s ruler. If I lay the ruler flat at the bridge and extend it to the end block of the guitar, there is a good 1/4" gap between the ruler and the binding at the end pin. If I run the ruler from the bridge to the neck, there is 3/32 or so dip around the sound hole. I know that flat tops aren't supposed to be perfectly flat, but this seems a bit excessive to me, so I am hoping the JLD may take care if of some of this "belly" as well. If there is some belly and the JLD does remove it, I am assuming I should be able to raise the saddle a bit and get some better break angles. With the bridge stabilized I am thinking based upon some other postings that I should be able to block sand about 1/8” off of the bridge and get so more of the saddle exposed….

Thoughts?

Thanks - Tom

 

[chazmo]

Tom,

I'm not sure if that deflection is excessive or not. I would visit a luthier before deciding on that course of action, but indeed I've heard mostly good things about the JLD.

Almost every guitar will develop some belly over time, but really the question is whether it's stabilized of increasing. Do you keep the humidity pretty well-controlled where you keep/store your guitar?

If you think the belly is too high, you might try unstringing it and stacking a pile of books on the lower bout to see if gravity will bring it down for you. If the humidity is high, you might want to use some silica-gel packs in the sound hole, and vice versa if it's too low you definitely want to put dampits in the soundhole. Point being to get the guitar to resume its correct shape.

This approach worked great for me on a severely bellied guitar that was a friend of mine's. When done, the top was totally normal, but braces needed to be glued by a luthier because the damage had already been done.

 

[taabru45]

Think I'd take it to a good Luthier, and ask him/her a few pointed questions....I have a 77 model like that, and its had a little work done on the bridge, but plays beautifully, light strings, and I don't think its going anywhere for another 30 or so years... :wink: Steffan

 

[GardMan]

I think you'll find mixed opinions on the use of a bridge doctor... some folks swear by 'em, some seem to loath them. The luthiers/techs (2-3) I have spoken with are also divided... one said "Never!" One said say they work as advertised, but take careful adjustment and a breaking in period. All thought they provide a reasonable means to salvage a playable guitar when a neck reset is not economical (IE, when the cost of the reset outweighs the monetary and sentimental value of the guitar).

Personally, I wouldn't include a '76 F50R in the latter category.. but that's just my $0.02.
D

 

[2Tone]

Thanks for the input folks, maybe a trip to a luthier is in order to get her overall health checked, since this a new guitar to me.

The guitar plays and sounds great; I just saw the JLD and thought it sounded like a good idea in general. I think I may have also gotten a little caught up with some of the "break angle" discussions, since there is little to none on the E and B strings. But hey - this is still the nicest sounding and playing guitar that I have ever owned, so why mess with it, right?

Anybody know of any reputable luthiers in the Denver Metro area? I will get her checked out for any major issues in the mean time just play and enjoy!!!

 

[charliea]

Keep in mind that the Bridge Doctor can't hurt anything, unless you get carried away. I have them on my two jumbo 12's as insurance. They aren't under tension. I'm not trying to flatten the tops. Just using the system as extra support for the bridges, and to keep the tops from lifting any more than they already have. There's some tone change but not as much as you might think, and you might actually prefer the new sound.

 

[killdeer43]

Here's a shot of the *Bridge Doctor that I installed on a D15 that now resides in Ohio (Howdy, Doc!).

*The small MOP inlay is the only evidence that the BDoctor is at work. It's easy to install and effective in curing belly problems. :wink:

Joe

 

[Taylor Martin Guild]

Remember that you can also get a Bridge Dr. with end pins that negate the need to drill the hole in the bridge.

I have never heard that a BD will help a guitar that needs a neck re-set.
Your thinking that it may pull the top back down and thus allow for a higher saddle intrigues me.

My wife has a Taylor guitar with a pin-less bridge.
The top on it is bellying, so I called Taylor and they said that it was under warranty and if the top became too bad, they would use a BD to flatten the top back down.
The neck angle is fine on it and the saddle has plenty of height.

Let us know if you do install a BD and the results.
Thanks,
TMG.

 

[2Tone]

Yeah - My plan was to get the $50 model which replaces the 'D' string pin with a brass "screw in" pin that holds the JLD to the guitar. It also comes with the remaining 5 brass pins that just bolt up to the top. From what I have seen most folks just use the one brass pin on the 'D' and use the original bridge pins for the other 5 strings. Apparently the original pins give you a better break angle on the saddle. If I liked the JLD enough I would evaluate installing it permanently. If I did so, I would probably just turn a plug for the screw hole needed in the bridge to make the install as inconspicuous as possible.

As soon as I find a luthier, and some time to get the guitar checked out, I will let you know if I decide to give the JLD a try and what the results are.

Thanks - Tom

 

[2Tone]

So I ended up talking to Don at JLD. First of all he and his wife Georgia are great folks! I explained my situation and he thought that the bridge doctor would work. He offered me the option of returning it if it didn’t fit the bill so I ordered one. When it showed up it wasn’t really what I had expected. The latest model doesn’t look like the one in the drawings posted on the JLD site, a more accurate representation can be found on the Stew-Mac web site. I installed it before our band practice last Thursday and was underwhelmed. I chose to use the brass pin on the D and my regular bridge pins on the rest of the strings. Immediately after I strung it up I noticed that the D string sounded quite a bit duller than the rest. I also didn’t see any appreciable movement in the bridge. Two hours later when I got home I picked it up again and the tone on all of the strings had evened out, so it apparently did something. I am assuming since the bridge hadn’t dropped noticeably in height that it had changed the angle a bit. At any rate it did not appear that is was going to do what I wanted which was to drop the overall height of the bridge. I also found that I preferred the tone of my guitar without the bridge doctor.

For my application, the Bridge doctor did not accomplish what I wanted, which was to drop the bridge a bit so that I could raise the saddle height. So I am going to pack it back up and ship it back to Don. The guitar plays great for now and hopefully will continue to do so for years to come. I have recorded the string heights at the 12th fret and will check the guitar now and again to make sure that they stay consistent. After poking around in the guitar while installing the bridge doctor it occurred to me that my F50R is built like a tank, and like Steffan, “I don't think its going anywhere for another 30 or so years….”

I will try to get some pictures up this week that show the shape of my top, and neck angle to bridge, for reference.

Thanks for all of the input,

Tom

 

[GardMan]

Tom,
From what I have read, it may take a series of adjustments over a span of weeks for a bridge doctor to have substantial effect in reducing the top belly.
D

 

[killdeer43]

Tom,
From what I have read, it may take a series of adjustments over a span of weeks for a bridge doctor to have substantial effect in reducing the top belly.
D

My understanding all along was that the BD is not an immediate fix, and that the individual guitar takes a little time to adjust to this new "body part." Possibly like an organ transplant? :wink:

Just sayin',
Joe

 

[2Tone]

Folks – Your point about the adjustment period is well taken, so in fairness to Don and his product I will expound a bit on the reasons why I decided to remove the bridge Dr. Please keep in mind this is my opinion, your mileage may vary

1) There were certain aspects about the product, installation, and how it fit in my guitar that made me uncomfortable
2) My guitar currently plays and sounds great. I was just trying to “milk” a little more out of her.
3) I wasn’t all that happy about my guitar sporting a “Gold tooth” (single brass bridge pin surrounded by the original white ones)

In the end I decided I will let my hands and ears be my guide, not saddle height, break angle, etc. So as long as my guitar continues to play and sound like it does I will be a happy camper. If this changes, I will start to revisit the different options available.

Finally if anyone reading this is trying to make decision on the product, definitely contact Don at JDL and make sure you purchase yours from him. He will answer all of your questions, and stands behind his product 100%!

 

[2Tone]

Oh yes and the pictures of the top....

Neck To Bridge

Bridge to Back

The Full Top

I haven't taken it to the Luthier yet to see if I officially have a belly