Year and wood types for this F-212?

[Hyrundo]

Hello everyone,


I'd like to receive info about a vintage Guild F-212 guitar, serial number (apparently) AN 2026 (see attached photos).
- is it possible to confirm that the guitar was made in Hoboken in the year 1969 (or close to that year)?
- is it possible to verify that the guitars from that period have mahogany back and sides, and spruce top?

Thank you in advance for any useful info,

with Best Regards
Hyr

 

[12 string]

Welcome! I can confirm spruce over mahogany.

' Strang

 

[Christopher Cozad]

Welcome to LTG, Hyr. The guitar in the photo definitely has a Mahogany back, and a Spruce soundboard. The guitar looks to be in relatively good condition. Do you happen to know the history behind the lacquer issue on the soundboard? The instrument appears to have suffered the classic soundboard shear as a result of movement in the neck block / upper bout at some point in its life.

 

[Hyrundo]

Do you happen to know the history behind the lacquer issue on the soundboard?

Hello and thank you all for your replies. Unfortunately I know nothing about the history of this beautiful guitar, but I hope to have the chance to evaluate it in person asap.

I have #2 more photos to evaluate about the potential 'neck block movement' issue: any hint that that might have happened?


PS. any suggestion about the serial number reference and the possible year of crafting?

Best Regards

 

[Christopher Cozad]

My guess is that the neck was reset at some point, and it looks like a good job. I would be eager to hear your assessment of this guitar, once you can visit it in person. So far, it looks pretty nice.

I think someone will visit this thread shortly and be able to give you more information regarding the date (or date range) of your guitar.

The neck block shift is common, and is not restricted to Guilds. It is the result of (what I believe to be) a design flaw in most acoustic guitars dating back to the 1850s (also known as the “dawn of time” to some enthusiasts). I prefer to address it on my guitars, but that is not saying you should feel compelled to do anything about it. Many guitar owners consider it such a “given” that they are resigned to live with it. To be fair, you would likely require instrumentation to measure any sound quality loss or improvement, before or after such a split occurred or was repaired.

Then again, neck block shift / soundboard shears can be pretty ugly:

 

[geoguy]

A closer photo of the soundboard near the end of the fretboard extension would be needed to see whether neck block movement had occurred in this guitar, imo.

 

[chazmo]

AN 2026 is 1969. Hans can tell us whether that's Hoboken or Westerly.

 

[adorshki]

Hello and thank you all for your replies. Unfortunately I know nothing about the history of this beautiful guitar, but I hope to have the chance to evaluate it in person asap.

I have #2 more photos to evaluate about the potential 'neck block movement' issue: any hint that that might have happened?

The neck block is inside the guitar under the fretboard extension, it's what the heel of the neck mates to when the neck's mounted. Evidence of movement may not be visible from the heel. Under high heat and humidity the glue can give under string tension and the neckblock gets "squeezed" out of alignment. This'll cause some movement of the fretboard which takes the top it's glued to with it, creating a slight crack along the line of the board to the soundhole.

PS. any suggestion about the serial number reference and the possible year of crafting?

Best Regards

Hi Hyundo, welcome! s/n AN2026 fits in the '69 slot as noted here:
https://guildguitars.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/history_of_your_guild.pdf

From '67-'69 Guild operated in both Hoboken and Westerly while production was being moved to Westerly, but all the '69 12-ers I can recall were confirmed as Hobokens. It's led me to suspect they kept higher-end production there until the end, but absolute confirmation can be had from our member @hansmoust.

 

[Hyrundo]

A closer photo of the soundboard near the end of the fretboard extension would be needed to see whether neck block movement had occurred in this guitar, imo.

The neck block is inside the guitar under the fretboard extension, it's what the heel of the neck mates to when the neck's mounted. Evidence of movement may not be visible from the heel. Under high heat and humidity the glue can give under string tension and the neckblock gets "squeezed" out of alignment. This'll cause some movement of the fretboard which takes the top it's glued to with it, creating a slight crack along the line of the board to the soundhole.

Here I can offer another image at a closer range of the guitar (so to zoom in on the neck joint - can you spot any sign of compromised alignment?). If any further detail emerged, I'm curious to read about it. Thank you in advance.

 

[adorshki]

Here I can offer another image at a closer range of the guitar (so to zoom in on the neck joint - can you spot any sign of compromised alignment?). If any further detail emerged, I'm curious to read about it. Thank you in advance.

Can't be confirmed from external pics as other things can cause a crack, or it may only be a finish crack. You need to have a luthier take a look at it. Or put a small cam in there and look or signs of displacement along the neckblock's sides and especially where it's glued under the fretboard. The heel may not show any shifting externally because it's still got the sides between it and the neck block, so it's somewhat "anchored" on the outside.

 

[Christopher Cozad]

It looks pretty nice, Hyrundo, especially for a 55-year-old 12 string.

 

[Prince of Darkness]

Here I can offer another image at a closer range of the guitar (so to zoom in on the neck joint - can you spot any sign of compromised alignment?). If any further detail emerged, I'm curious to read about it. Thank you in advance.

Based on that picture, I can't really see any sign of movement. If there has been any then it's minimal

 

[wileypickett]

In the first of the two back / side photos, it appears to me the bottom half of the neck block may have shifted. If you look at the light reflection on the binding above the heel cap, you can see it's flatter / indented compared to the area around it.

There are also cracks (maybe just finish cracks?) in the sides that are consistent with just part of the bottom part of neck-block shifting.

I agree you need to have a luthier look it over. We're just spit-balling based on what little we can see.

 

[adorshki]

In the first of the two side / back photos, it appears to me the bottom half of the neck block may have shifted. If you look at the light reflection on the binding above the heel cap, you can see it's flatter / indented compared to the area around it.

There are also cracks (maybe just finish cracks?) in the sides that are consistent with just part of the bottom part of neck-block shifting.

I agree you need to have a luthier look it over. We're just spit-balling based on what little we can see.

Based on that picture, I can't really see any sign of movement. If there has been any then it's minimal

A lot might depend on what you're viewing it on, as well.