D55 neck finish

BurstD55

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No I don't have another Guild... Can I borrow one of yours???

I appreciate the guidance.

I am sure the high humidity lately has some effect on the softened finish. I have been diligently keeping my house at 60% relative humidity, but outside the humidity is well above 70%. 60% is about the best that I can do with my dehumidifier and wife that turns it off and on whenever she pleases. I also have silica beads in the case that have been recently been dried out in the oven.
 

adorshki

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BurstD55 said:
No I don't have another Guild... Can I borrow one of yours???
I appreciate the guidance.
I am sure the high humidity lately has some effect on the softened finish. I have been diligently keeping my house at 60% relative humidity, but outside the humidity is well above 70%. 60% is about the best that I can do with my dehumidifier and wife that turns it off and on whenever she pleases. I also have silica beads in the case that have been recently been dried out in the oven.
I've heard of the humidity issue but personally I'm a little skeptical as lacquer is not water-soluble for one thing, and I live in California where the relative humidity stays between 45-55% year round. I'm convinced most cases are the result of body acids/salts softening the finish as mentioned elsewhere on the forum. Also because the problem is usually limited to the areas of skin contact. The heat may accelerate the action of the acids though.
I am sympathetic to your request for a loaner but like any good husband and father I don't allow any of my harem to leave the house unescorted... :lol:
 

BurstD55

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Yeah I was thinking that lacquer is not water soluble but the high humidity is what is preventing the softened spot from drying quick. Kind of like painting in high humidity you need longer dry times... Just a thought not a theory.

Thats the right answer about loaning out one of your 'harem'! And who knows maybe my skin would damage one of yours...

Thanks.
 

taabru45

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Hi guys...Al good point about the 'youth' of the guitar....remember my Jumbos are over 30 years old, and have dried long ago......I notice when wiping down my new D50 that the rag sticks a little where my forearm was, so I buff it a bit till the whole top isn't sticking to the cloth in any way....never did much about polish on the old jumbos, did use lemon oil to clean them once in a while.....they still look great, though they don't go on the road, or anything like that.....just me and them. so they don't have a huge amount of 'milage' on them.....Steffan :D
 

JerryR

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taabru45 said:
..I notice when wiping down my new D50 that the rag sticks a little where my forearm was, so I buff it a bit till the whole top isn't sticking to the cloth in any way........Steffan :D

Huh - just like new car syndrome, only 'new guitar syndrome' - every little patch and scratch a disaster :mrgreen:
 

taabru45

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Yeah....that could really piss a guy off, jerry....Steffan :shock:
12458_20100815_1.jpg
 

adorshki

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BurstD55 said:
Yeah I was thinking that lacquer is not water soluble but the high humidity is what is preventing the softened spot from drying quick. Kind of like painting in high humidity you need longer dry times... Just a thought not a theory.
Actually makes a lot of sense, I get it now.
BurstD55 said:
Thats the right answer about loaning out one of your 'harem'! And who knows maybe my skin would damage one of yours...Thanks.
Well in the case of the D25 at least the damage is already done...but the other two don't have near the hours and weren't played for hours in a hot summer sun, and were always wiped down after playing.
Seems I see a lot of mention of "stickiness" on the NH guitars, now Steffan's also mentioning it. I suspect maybe the formulation is a little more prone to this problem than what was used in Westerly, but it may also be because we haven't really seen so many truly "factory fresh" guitars in quite a while so the reports are simply more numerous. In the end though, there's really nothing like a brand new Guild, is there? (See my sig?)
You really DO want to jealously guard "her" from any "dings". Or any other unplanned events.... :lol:
 

devellis

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Although Guild takes pride in its nitro finish, I think it's more a liability than an asset. There are modern finishes that go on thin, look great, and wear like iron.

People's body chemistry can react with finishes. I've noticed guitars in shops that had unbelievably sticky necks that no amount of wiping down could help, yet have played identical guitars that haven't been handled by a zillion people that never developed that stickiness -- presumably because no one with reactive body chemistry had played them. Some of the unsticky guitars saw a lot more daily playing over a longer time than the ones in the stores, yet never became sticky. I can't state this as a fact but I strongly suspect that body chemistry may initiate changes in the surface that makes it sticky.

I'd recommend keeping wax off of guitars if you're having problems with a cloudy haze developing. You know those white rings you get on your coffee table when you set a glass with ice in it on the table and it sweats? That's wax reacting with water. This isn't the only process that can cause clouding, but it's one of them.

A good cleaning with naphtha should strip off wax, which may help. Really, just a wipe-down with a dry cloth should keep a guitar clean. Next step up is a wipe-down with a barely damp cloth, which will remove any water-soluble grunge. Next is a wipe-down with a naphtha-dampened cloth will remove more stubborn grunge. Lastly, something like swirl remover is about the most aggressive cleaning I'd give a guitar. It will remove stuff that's embedded in the surface and will also remove small scratches and restore luster. I use the Meguiar's auto products that are sold for cleaning convertible top plastic windows. It comes in two stages, one a cleaner and one a polish. I've used it on everything from century-old-plus vintage instruments to much newer stuff than needed a thorough cleaning. It works great, but is rarely needed.
 

BurstD55

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Last night I tried to take some pics of the finish wounds. It is hard to photograph but here is the only one that turned out any good, the arrow points to the visible portion of soft finish.

haze.JPG


Couple more just for fun:
IMG_2444.JPG

IMG_2443.JPG


I know I need to cut the grass!
 

chazmo

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Burst,

For the record, you've got yourself an extremely beautiful guitar there. I know it's a personal opinion, but I think you're worrying about this too much as far as the body is concerned. What you need to do is start collecting some 20/30/40-year old examples of these fantastic guitars and that'll put things in perspective. ;)

Really, that's just tongue and cheek on my part (my wife already thinks I'm insane), but the serious result is that you come to appreciate how fantastically these finishes age. Devellis above presents a cogent argument for abandoning nitrocellulose finish, but misses the point about age and how the guitar just gets better and better (from certain points of view, of course). A Guild can be a lifetime guitar though many of us let the collector mentality get in the way of that.

In any case, I hope you can sort the neck problem sorted out. Anything that affects playability of a guitar needs to be addressed (IMO).
 

BurstD55

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Yeah Chaz I totally agree. I am taking this way too serious. And yeah the fact that the neck is sticky is a bit of a playability issue.

I bought the guitar as a player not an investment, but it is a little disheartening to see the finish doing this! Nobody will likely notice it other than me, but I would still like to get it taken care of so that any preventable damage can be avoided.

For the mean time I will take the advice given and let it dry for a while only wiping off after playing, and forget about it...
 

jazzmang

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BurstD55 said:
Yeah Chaz I totally agree. I am taking this way too serious. And yeah the fact that the neck is sticky is a bit of a playability issue.

I bought the guitar as a player not an investment, but it is a little disheartening to see the finish doing this! Nobody will likely notice it other than me, but I would still like to get it taken care of so that any preventable damage can be avoided.

For the mean time I will take the advice given and let it dry for a while only wiping off after playing, and forget about it...

I know the feeling. My hands make a nitro finish get very sticky. My fix (on both CT Guilds and older ones) was the following:

1) A good cleaning with a mix of water and very diluted, mild dish soap. Dry with a microfiber cloth.
2) With a microfiber cloth, clean the neck and any other soft spots with naptha (lighter fluid).
3) I used a product called guitar scratch remover (www.guitarscratchremover.com) to wax and polish the guitar thoroughly. I'm not associated with this stuff, but I've used it on all my Guilds and it's worked amazingly well. I'm sure there are things out there that work in a similar manner. Anyways, after this treatment, I'll have a very smooth, hard finish for a long long time.

Hope that helps!
 

wontox

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Jeez, guys, if the neck finish is so problematic, take the nitro off the neck-only with acetone and refinish the neck-only with poly. If the nitro is tinted you may need to apply stain. An easy fix and if done carefully, there will be zero visible or acoustic effect. It's all about playing the guitar, right? A sticky neck this old is not going to harden.

Wontox
 

BurstD55

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As an update of my finish issues I experienced last summer:

Now that my home humidity is around 35% to 45% and I have activated the humidifier in my case I have noticed that all the soft finish spots are gone completely.

The problem is with the humidity here in the summer as we seem to constantly be above 65%. I had even put two wallet sized pouches of descant crystals in the case and still could not keep the soft finish under control, must have been because I would take the guitar out of the case and play it in the high humidity causing moisture to be trapped under where my skin makes contact with the finish.

The guitar has been at proper humidity for a few months now and all is well with the D55.

You guys were right! If anybody else experiences this on a nitro finish just leave it alone, rubbing and polishing will just make it worse because as others have mentioned you can wear the finish off.
 

Taylor Martin Guild

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I have seen a few different things that folks have used to help with the problem on the top of the guitar.
Some have made a cover for the top corner of their guitar. It covers the area that gets cloudy, when playing.
Others have made an arm sleeve that they wear when playing.
Others just wear a long sleeved shirt.

I have thought about the JP arm rest but not enough to get one yet.

My guitars all have a dull spot on the top, where my arm rests when I play.
I clean it, polish it and live with it.
 

adorshki

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Taylor Martin Guild said:
My guitars all have a dull spot on the top, where my arm rests when I play.
I clean it, polish it and live with it.
Yep. Don't like long sleeves, restricts freedom of motion when strumming, even picking, 'cause I move a lot between bottom of fretboard to close to the bridge. Don't want to attach anything to the guitar either. Wiping down right afterward probably helps a lot though. Wish I'd known that when I was younger.
 

curt

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Polish that contains any water makes the problem worse, it's like putting a glass on a wood table. Use 3M Trizact 3000 followed but a very fine compound and throw your polish away.
 
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