Diary and question about glue for westerly label

[Seiki Yoshida]

hi folks


currently i m waiting for new member of my guild family that is 74s F50R
cant wait till i hold and play it.

looks like some of online shops there has international shippment service.
i found DV72 aporx. 2500 us dollars last month but its already sold out...

https://www.j-guitar.com/products/detail.php?id=1172801&lang=en >> this is the F50R that i ordered last night

【Jギター】国内最大級のギター情報サイト、ギターや楽器を全国の楽器店から検索・通販

国内最大級のギター情報サイト。新品・中古・ビンテージのエレキギターやアコギ、楽器を楽器店から検索・購入。ギター講座や製品情報も！

www.j-guitar.com

by the way, my sweet d55 label peeled off during cleaning.
any suggestion or recommendation to put it again?

i m wondering which is considered paper glue or wood glue in this case.....??
does the orginal glue still exist?

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awaiting for your reply.
thank you.

 

[chazmo]

Seiki, I would not re-apply the label. Put it in a plastic bag, or laminate it, and leave it in your case in case you ever need to sell it and document it.

 

[Heath]

Seiki, I would not re-apply the label. Put it in a plastic bag, or laminate it, and leave it in your case in case you ever need to sell it and document it.

Not saying you’re wrong, but why? I imagine the original glue was just a simple glue. What would the harm be in reapplying it with a little of whatever glue was originally used?

Again, just curious.

 

[chazmo]

No harm, really. No benefit either. My thoughts are that the label is all messy with old glue and dirt now and won't really reapply cleanly.

I just wouldn't do it.

 

[Seiki Yoshida]

Hi Chaz san

I m still keeping and securing it in plastic bag but my thinking is westerly guilds are visually beautiful with the label on.
So i m considering reapplying it.
Asking luthier would be fine but they are too far from my place.

I hope if any LTGer know about original glue or what kind of glue is best for reapplying, then we can know new knowledge. There might be several glue for rosewood or different tone wood. If so i m curious.

Your opinion would be last choice for me if i gave up reapplying it.
Thanks for your opinion.

 

[chazmo]

Fair enough, Seiki! Good luck!

 

[adorshki]

Hi Chaz san

I m still keeping and securing it in plastic bag but my thinking is westerly guilds are visually beautiful with the label on.
So i m considering reapplying it.
Asking luthier would be fine but they are too far from my place.

I hope if any LTGer know about original glue or what kind of glue is best for reapplying, then we can know new knowledge. There might be several glue for rosewood or different tone wood. If so i m curious.

Your opinion would be last choice for me if i gave up reapplying it.
Thanks for your opinion.

Hi Seiki, those labels were printed on label paper that was backed with simple rice or wheat flour glue. It was just moistened with a sponge before being applied, or the glue was just applied with a brush or sponge just before applying. If there wasn't enough glue, or it was too wet when applied, it could cause the label to eventually come loose. Sometimes it's just simple aging in the right conditions.

I understand the advice to save the label, it's in very good condition, and some members have guitars whose labels have been lost. But at least if you want try to re-attach it you know the proper glue that won't cause wrinkling like regular "white glue ("Elmer's")".

I think also care needs to be taken that the area where it was is appropriately prepared for the re-glue, or it may simply come loose again.
I don't know what to actually suggest for that, maybe as simple as some wiping with a damp rag (distilled water) followed by an alcohol rub? Keeping the wood pretty dry, of course.

Our member @davismanLV has some woodworking experience, or perhaps @AcornHouse who's a luthier, might have better advice.

 

[Seiki Yoshida]

Hi Seiki, those labels were printed on label paper that was backed with simple rice or wheat flour glue. It was just moistened with a sponge before being applied, or the glue was just applied with a brush or sponge just before applying. If there wasn't enough glue, or it was too wet when applied, it could cause the label to eventually come loose. Sometimes it's just simple aging in the right conditions.

I understand the advice to save the label, it's in very good condition, and some members have guitars whose labels have been lost. But at least if you want try to re-attach it you know the proper glue that won't cause wrinkling like regular "white glue ("Elmer's")".

I think also care needs to be taken that the area where it was is appropriately prepared for the re-glue, or it may simply come loose again.
I don't know what to actually suggest for that, maybe as simple as some wiping with a damp rag (distilled water) followed by an alcohol rub? Keeping the wood pretty dry, of course.

Our member @davismanLV has some woodworking experience, or perhaps @AcornHouse who's a luthier, might have better advice.

hi adorshki san.

never made rice or wheat flour glue just as 'glue'. i think i need practice with a trash papar and scrap wood first of all.
thanks for your info~

 

[Guildedagain]

I would use "mucilage" glue, the glue for scrapbookers that doesn't wrinkle paper, and yes, I would absolutely reattach label, the guitar is worth more and indeed more visually appealing with label on, as it should be. Maybe brush off excess crud/lint from label/label area prior to affixing.

I've been very fortunate to have all Guilds with labels intact, and in good condition.

Something of a study though, is the placement of labels, no two are the same. A lack of uniformity, or maybe particular to model runs.

Hans maybe could shed light in this, GOG, or Wagner, or Richard69, anyone who's had multiples of a same year model.

Some label orientation samples of mine.

'68 F112, horizontal orientation

'71 F30

Vertical orientation

Arched back DC5E

 

[adorshki]

hi adorshki san.

never made rice or wheat flour glue just as 'glue'. i think i need practice with a trash papar and scrap wood first of all.
thanks for your info~

I like Guildedagain's suggestion of mucilage, in post #9 just above, and he's got experience in that issue as he noted.
I'm guessing you may still be able to see how the label was originally oriented.

 

[Seiki Yoshida]

I would use "mucilage" glue, the glue for scrapbookers that doesn't wrinkle paper, and yes, I would absolutely reattach label, the guitar is worth more and indeed more visually appealing with label on, as it should be. Maybe brush off excess crud/lint from label/label area prior to affixing.

I've been very fortunate to have all Guilds with labels intact, and in good condition.

Something of a study though, is the placement of labels, no two are the same. A lack of uniformity, or maybe particular to model runs.

Hans maybe could shed light in this, GOG, or Wagner, or Richard69, anyone who's had multiples of a same year model.

Some label orientation samples of mine.

'68 F112, horizontal orientation

'71 F30

Vertical orientation

Arched back DC5E

hi, guilded san !!

i m serching mucilage online market.
some say its just a glue apply it but my idea is toyota should use japanese materials, ford should use U.S material.
this is why i m askin on LTG.


mine had been glued like 90 degree to the center bracing like this. so the Guild stamp on the bracing looks like new for its age.
its gonna be a bit tricky work for me because it is not flat.

thanks for information


↓ last summer

 

[Guildedagain]

Should be easy enough to reinstall, take your time, with clean hands, don't put glue right to the edges or it might squeeze out.

Move label around a tiny bit to spread glue out, use folded paper towel to push label flat rather than a roller, and know when to walk away.

A full sized image of your avatar would be nice.

 

[Heath]

I feel like this is being over thought. If you can get the label close to how it was and lightly apply the glue that was discussed, you should be fine. We’re not talking about matching serial numbers on a vintage Porsche engine

I’m not trying to be dismissive, I only feel that this is one of the easier things we can address with the correct glue mentioned above.

 

[adorshki]

hi, guilded san !!

i m serching mucilage online market.
some say its just a glue apply it but my idea is toyota should use japanese materials, ford should use U.S material.
this is why i m askin on LTG.

Elmer's and LePage are American brands, but "mucilage" is a generic term like "wheat flour" glue.

 

[adorshki]

I feel like this is being over thought. If you can get the label close to how it was and lightly apply the glue that was discussed, you should be fine. We’re not talking about matching serial numbers on a vintage Porsche engine

I’m not trying to be dismissive, I only feel that this is one of the easier things we can address with the correct glue mentioned above.

 

[Seiki Yoshida]

Elmer's andLePage are American brands, but "mucilage" is a generic term like "wheat flour" glue.

oh ~ thanks

 

[Seiki Yoshida]

I feel like this is being over thought. If you can get the label close to how it was and lightly apply the glue that was discussed, you should be fine. We’re not talking about matching serial numbers on a vintage Porsche engine

I’m not trying to be dismissive, I only feel that this is one of the easier things we can address with the correct glue mentioned above.

hi Heath san,

yeah... i agree but in japan we dont see many westerly guild recently than gibson or martin.
i simply am afraid of makin mistake and keep it as original state as much as possible ecept for the expendables like nut, saddle.

 

[adorshki]

hi Heath san,

yeah... i agree but in japan we dont see many westerly guild recently than gibson or martin.
i simply am afraid of makin mistake and keep it as original state as much as possible ecept for the expendables like nut, saddle.

Seiki san, it occurred to me we frequently see rare and unusual Guilds offered on Japanese seller's sites, and we're often surprised the prices seem so high compared to what we're accustomed to here in the US.

I only bring this up because it occurs to me you may have paid more dearly for your guitar than we're accustomed to here in the US. It's only natural you want to take the best possible care. I also realized your culture may place more importance on the preservation of originality than the typical American does.

I just want you to know there's many here who understand and appreciate your care for detail.

 

[Seiki Yoshida]

Seiki san, it occurred to me we frequently see rare and unusual Guilds offered on Japanese seller's sites, and we're often surprised the prices seem so high compared to what we're accustomed to here in the US.

I only bring this up because it occurs to me you may have paid more dearly for your guitar than we're accustomed to here in the US. It's only natural you want to take the best possible care. I also realized your culture may place more importance on the preservation of originality than the typical American does.

I just want you to know there's many here who understand and appreciate your care for detail.

Adorshki san
first of all, thank you for your heartful comment

yes and no... for how often we see old guilds online in japan.
we see guilds in big city like Osaka area or Tokyo but i rarely see them around my place.

my guitar friends or my colleagues always say like 'oh you have guilds, let me try your guitar'
because their eyes always watching martin or gibson, maybe tayler more.
i think almost all japanese guitar players who were young in 60s ~ 80s know guilds but recently not and in my country old guys tend to have much money than young guys, as a result, old guitar price is getting higher.
also japanese Yen and US dollars currency rate is getting bigger than before.

i paid 1,950 US dollars for my D55 from American on reverb.com.
there may be always currency rate problem but i feel used D25 ~ D40 in japan seem higher than US market.


I just want you to know there's many here who understand and appreciate your care for detail.
>> thank you. i love this phrase & i love this forum too. of course, i try to understand all comment and try to put comment into real guild life of mine.
one question, i am not native speaker of English, does my english sound rude or impolite??
　 some says japanese people are shy and don't express their opinions, so I try & hope not to hurt anyone by my english...

 

[adorshki]

Adorshki san
first of all, thank you for your heartful comment

You're quite welcome!

>> thank you. i love this phrase & i love this forum too. of course, i try to understand all comment and try to put comment into real guild life of mine.
one question, i am not native speaker of English, does my english sound rude or impolite??
　 some says japanese people are shy and don't express their opinions, so I try & hope not to hurt anyone by my english...

Your English is very good. I'm (in fact I suspect all of us are) sympathetic to members whose primary language isn't English. It's actually easy for me to guess what someone's trying to say, even if their usage is a little bit "incorrect". But I still try to make sure I understand by offering my interpretation of an unclear statement, so they can confirm or make better explanation.

In your case I suspect you've had pretty good English courses .