I'm confused about this D25 Cherry

[casey2048]

Seller claims it is a 1969 model, But the serial number is confusing. No corresponding stamp on the headstock. Were there any instances of experimenting with cherry D25s back then?

Guild D-25 Bluegrass 1968 - 1973 | Reverb

Reverb is a marketplace bringing together a wide-spanning community to buy, sell, and discuss all things music gear.

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I am interested in the period and when Guild stopped making flatbacks / started making the arched ones because I would like to get a flatback D25. This is just a little puzzle and I figured if anyone could solve it would be someone here.
(Nice grain on that top.)

 

[GGJaguar]

Could be from 1970. Hans will know for sure. I don't see anything wrong with it being Cherry finished from that time periods, but again, Hans will know. Very cool guitar!!

 

[adorshki]

Seller claims it is a 1969 model, But the serial number is confusing. No corresponding stamp on the headstock. Were there any instances of experimenting with cherry D25s back then?

Guild D-25 Bluegrass 1968 - 1973 | Reverb

Reverb is a marketplace bringing together a wide-spanning community to buy, sell, and discuss all things music gear.

reverb.com

I am interested in the period and when Guild stopped making flatbacks / started making the arched ones because I would like to get a flatback D25. This is just a little puzzle and I figured if anyone could solve it would be someone here.
(Nice grain on that top.)

D25 was introduced in '68 as an all-hog flatback dreadnought with 2 finishes, Cherry and Brown.That one's got the original style guard, though I seem to recall seeing one on a '70 too.

Label's fine although I doubt it was actually built in Hoboken which was already ramping down by '68 and appeared to be reserved for the higher-end flattops while Westerly was ramping up in '67-68. Hoboken was closed "by 1969" according to The Guild Guitar Book.

They kept using Hoboken labels well into '70 (or was it even '72? I forget), but in any case it's known they kept using Hoboken labels for the first couple of years of Westerly production. Speculation is it was due to Al Dronge's exceedingly frugal nature, no joke. He also literally refused to throw out old "obsolete" parts.

Sometime in '72 the first D25's with arched backs appeared. They still had 'hog tops. This version of the '25 was in production through '73 and '74 and some "outliers" of '75 and even a '76 have been reported. These may have been old bodies finally completed.

Sometime in '73 the first spruce -topped archbacks appeared. We've seen examples of both types from '73 and '74, so I have to conclude they actually built both archback types at the time, maybe in alternating production runs?

By '74 the "catalog" version was the hog archback body with spruce top. So for flatbacks you want to to concentrate on '68 (scarcer'n hen's teeth) through 72 with '73's being "possibles", just look for the back brace.

Not sure about lack of s/n on headstock, don't recall it being a known "issue". Is it possible it's just almost impossible to see, especially in pics? That's not uncommon.

 

[adorshki]

Could be from 1970. Hans will know for sure. I don't see anything wrong with it being Cherry finished from that time periods, but again, Hans will know. Very cool guitar!!

Just about guaranteed '70, OG514 falls after OG233, last number for '69.

@Caseyholford : Guild didn't change s/n systems on the calendar year, so the "OG"
system was used for some time into '70, then the pure numeric system was used again.

So the "46696" isn't really the first number produced in 70, just the first one they had a record of. We're aware of that glitch that causes some s/n's to "disappear".

I wonder if the headstock stamp's missing because they'd already changed the dies for the stamper?

 

[chazmo]

That is a flat-back, Casey. So, yeah, 1969 through early '70s. You won't find a flat-back after '73ish. They started making flat-backs again during the Corona era, Casey, so you might look in that direction. Those are super nice guitars. Also, all the MIC GAD25s and D-125s were flat backs although they also have mahogany tops so they sound more compressed like the originals. The D-20 from Oxnard is also a flat-back.

 

[casey2048]

Thanks so much for all the knowledge everyone! I love that this group is full of experts. I’m definitely interested in finding one of these old flatties.

@chazmo yeah I actually have a modern D20, but I’ve played an old time flat D25 too so I know they’re different enough that I could benefit from having both! (At least for a bit, to satisfy my fancy )

 

[chazmo]

Thanks so much for all the knowledge everyone! I love that this group is full of experts. I’m definitely interested in finding one of these old flatties.

@chazmo yeah I actually have a modern D20, but I’ve played an old time flat D25 too so I know they’re different enough that I could benefit from having both! (At least for a bit, to satisfy my fancy )

The one in your picture appears to have a mahogany top as well. Good luck with the hunt, Casey.

 

[HeyMikey]

Braces on the back = flat back.

 

[adorshki]

I’m definitely interested in finding one of these old flatties.

There's a lot to be said for the compatibility of friends of similar age, regardless of upper bout depth.

 

[casey2048]

There's a lot to be said for the compatibility of friends of similar age, regardless of upper bout depth.

hmm you might have to decode that one for me, friend!

 

[adorshki]

hmm you might have to decode that one for me, friend!

"Old flatties are good flatties"

 

[adorshki]

Thanks so much for all the knowledge everyone! I love that this group is full of experts. I’m definitely interested in finding one of these old flatties.

@chazmo yeah I actually have a modern D20, but I’ve played an old time flat D25 too so I know they’re different enough that I could benefit from having both! (At least for a bit, to satisfy my fancy )

Just remembered the one-year only DV25 from '00, a flatback spruce-top D25, I assume offered as a stop-gap between the just-dropped DV-6 and the about-to-be-reinstated D40:
https://www.gad.net/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Guild-2000-Catalog-Pg18_1600.jpeg

Of the 3 we've sen offered over the last 15 years, the one that was up a couple of year ago claimed to have been the last guitar from Westerly, miraculously escaping the band-saw as Fender unceremoniously shut the doors, just before the big factory fire.

Seller had a rich fantasy life which I can understand, but not condone in this instance.

 

[WaltW]

Coincidence? There's a 1977 D25CH up for auction on ebay today. Not a flatback but it's the first one I've seen since I purchased my D312SB in 1978. It looks decent considering the age, but who am I to judge. I'm not much a critic.
I don't believe I've ever seen a guild flatback, not around guitars much since 1993 when life got really lifey for a few years.!

 

[Br1ck]

I'd love to have this guitar. You'd better buy it. If it's a 70, it's a good year. Or a 68 or a 69. It would make a fine companion for my D 35.

Don't worry about me buying it, I'm still recovering from Santa Cruz shock. But I'd pay that price for a flatback with appropriate wear.

 

[casey2048]

if you did I wouldn't be sad @Br1ck !

this one is sorta in my area which is a plus for me. I was hoping to check it out tomorrow but that isn’t possible because of my schedule unfortunately. I’ll try to make it next week. Looks like a cool example though with an interesting top and perhaps white binding? I asked for more photos but haven’t gotten any yet. https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/6273365222732195/?mibextid=IouU6C

 

[Norrissey]

I love my '71 D25 flatback. Highly recommend them. Rich and resonant and usually very reasonably priced considering how good they are.
That cherry one you're looking at looks nice. Guitar Center currently have a '72 D25 for sale. Of course with Guitar Center you never know what you're gonna get but at least you can easily return the guitar within 3 days if you don't like it or if there is an issue with it.

Vintage Guild 1972 D25 Acoustic Guitar

Shop for the Vintage Guild 1972 D25 Acoustic Guitar and receive free shipping on your order and the guaranteed lowest price.

www.guitarcenter.com

A pic of my one is below:

 

[casey2048]

That’s a beauty! Yes I saw the one on GC. it’s a good deal but I need to call them and inquire into the condition. I find I usually do ok by giving them a call. I’m assuming from the condition rating it probably needs a reset but who knows.

 

[casey2048]

Actually I take it back - I hadn’t looked at that listing and it looks really nice. I was confusing it with another one i saw. The pics in this one are unusually nice for a Guitar Center listing. Saddle might be a bit low? Hard to tell. But you’re right, might be worth just ordering it to my nearest GC and checking it out. Thanks @Norrissey !

 

[Norrissey]

Thanks @Norrissey !

You're very welcome. Good luck with your search!

 

[midnightright]

I owned one of these from 1973 for a time and it was the cherry red, all mahogany, flat backed version. It was about 35 yrs. old at that point & left an imprint on me that has not faded over time. I've had a number of other sweet D-25's & D-4's with arched backs, and spruce tops. There certainly was something special and unique about this one. It was kind of the ultimate late-night, "singer songwriter guitar," for me.

I miss it's voice, and if I had the patience for repairs these days, I'd probably have found a replacement by now. Though it's hard to imagine one stacking up to--& comparing to--this one. It had a personality that was all its own, and quite remarkable.

'Mellow,' was the word used to describe it's tone to me when I was auditioning it. There may be better/more accurate adjectives available; but that might be a decent word to help someone who hasn't played one before. It sounds like you are well-versed in this area though. Best wishes!