just got back from Frankfurt Musik messe and....

[Default]

I believe it was established that cmg handles Guild warrantees.

 

[adorshki]

..but Fender is ultimately responsible for NH warranty repairs.

Charlie, not pickin' on ya but I don't get how that could work.
Is it something you could put in a nutshell?
Otherwise, I'd be ok with "it's complicated" and maybe a pointer to what you're basing that statement on.
Understanding we've butted heads in past, I promise to back off on this, if you prefer.

 

[SFIV1967]

FMIC warranted NH Guild guitars, not Guild. They're still liable.

As far as I read it FMIC are no longer liable, CMG took over.
See: http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...ild-warranty&p=1646307&viewfull=1#post1646307 and http://guildguitars.com/warranty-policy/
Ralf

 

[dreamics]

HI Dreamics, welcome aboard! Yes they do watch this forum and I'm absolutely positive everything said in this thread is being considered and digested. Your other post about the nature of marketing and brand image building shows some great insight, and maybe personal experience?

Hi adorshki,
Your opinion honors me. Experience? well, I'm sensitive to what brands really mean.
And I totally agree with what you said about the difference between Westerly "series" and "collection". It's subtle, so it's important.

Now for me, it's time to go to sleep.

 

[adorshki]

No, FMIC are no longer liable, CMG took over.
See: http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...ild-warranty&p=1646307&viewfull=1#post1646307 and http://guildguitars.com/warranty-policy/
Ralf

I was wondering if Charlie was trying to imply something different based on some legal technicality we're not yet seeing here. Otherwise that's how I understood it too.

 

[adorshki]

Experience? well, I'm sensitive to what brands really mean.

Our moderator Frono was conducting an informal survey about that same subject about the time I joined.
I loved it.
I'm in sales myself and have seen brands come and go and have seen ones I love go on a different path than I would have preferred.
There's a lot to be said for being able to reassure a customer a product will not fail on them just by telling them it's made by a maker with a universally recognized and respected reputation.
THAT's the image Cordoba must achieve if they want to survive, but I guess that's kind of a pedantic observation at this poiint.

 

[killdeer43]

Guild - Schmild - Let's face it, it's over. Fender killed it the minute they bought it, schlepping it all over the country, slashing jobs and livelihoods in the pursuit of profit, and then dumped it onto another Californian Co. - a place with such a tradition of acoustic guitar making right? whose first task is to re-do the Chinese range. It's over, forget it,
enjoy your old guitars, that's all there is now. My first and probably my last post.

When I saw a first post, my thought was to offer a WELCOME TO LTG, but after reading the last line, should I change that to ADIOS?

Curious Joe

 

[killdeer43]

Here's the solution....

....the Westerly Road Collection. :friendly_wink:

Joe

 

[charliea]

As far as I read it FMIC are no longer liable, CMG took over.
See: http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...ild-warranty&p=1646307&viewfull=1#post1646307 and http://guildguitars.com/warranty-policy/
Ralf

I'm not concerned, because I don't anticipate any warranty claims, however nothing in those threads, or in CMG's current Guild warranty, indicates that they accepted, purchased or whatever, FMIC's warranty liabilities. They state that they'll be handling warranty claims for purchases after 7/14, but make no statement concerning purchases prior to that time. Member bonecrusher inquired whether they would be warranting Guild guitars. They said the purchase was complete, so they'd be doing the warranting. Nothing was said about prior purchases. Again, I'm sure it's not a problem, but I'm not aware of a definitive statement as to who is legally responsible for FMIC's warranty liabilities.

 

[txbumper57]

I'm not concerned, because I don't anticipate any warranty claims, however nothing in those threads, or in CMG's current Guild warranty, indicates that they accepted, purchased or whatever, FMIC's warranty liabilities. They state that they'll be handling warranty claims for purchases after 7/14, but make no statement concerning purchases prior to that time. Member bonecrusher inquired whether they would be warranting Guild guitars. They said the purchase was complete, so they'd be doing the warranting. Nothing was said about prior purchases. Again, I'm sure it's not a problem, but I'm not aware of a definitive statement as to who is legally responsible for FMIC's warranty liabilities.

For what it is worth, This is the actual response from Kevin Castaneda at Fender Regarding the warranty subject with Cordoba. Just putting it out there.

I have personally dealt with this issue so I do know how it is laid out within the actual contract with Cordoba. They are responsible for all warranty issues except with the ARCOS Series which would be taken care of by us. The D55 50th Anniversary model is not an ARCOS series, so if you are able to find it new, they would honor the warranty.
Thanks,
Kevin Castaneda
Consumer Relations Representative/Direct Sales
Fender Musical Instruments Corp.
17600 N. Perimeter Drive, Suite 100
Scottsdale, AZ 85255
Telephone: 480-845-5143
Fax: 480-367-5262
E-Mail: kcastaneda@fender.com

 

[fronobulax]

Food for thought: FMIC warranted NH Guild guitars, not Guild. They're still liable. If CMG gracefully accepts the liability, great, but Fender is ultimately responsible for NH warranty repairs.

NO. WRONG.

Now that I have your attention... There are several reliable sources that report that FMIC transferred assets and liabilities of Guild to CMG. The liabilities included warranties for Guild branded product produced under FMIC stewardship with the explicit exception of the MIM Arcos series for which warranty liabilities were explicitly retained by FMIC. It is not a matter of graciously accepting responsibility as much as it is adhering to the terms of a legal document.

My sources are LTG posts and conversations with dealers who purchased NH built stock from FMIC and were told, in writing by both FMIC and CMG that the warranty claims for that stock would be assessed by and honored, if valid, by Cordoba. Validity includes an expressed opinion that the problem to be corrected is a defect in materials and workmanship and not the result of accident or abuse.

Gracious acceptance of responsibility comes in to play if Cordoba honors a warranty claim on a pre-FMIC Guild. IMO, because we just don't know the legal details of the various changes in ownership.

 

[SFIV1967]

...however nothing in those threads, or in CMG's current Guild warranty, indicates that they accepted, purchased or whatever, FMIC's warranty liabilities. .

In that first link I posted CMG had sent an e-mail answer to bonecrusher in July 2014 saying: "The acquisition of Guild is now final, so any warranty claims will be handled by Cordoba Music Group." That was after he was asking who would honor the warranty on a new NH Guild. And CMGs warranty document was from mid 2014, and CMG clearly had not produced any Guild guitars, so it was sounding clear they will honor all previous Guilds warranty claims within the limits provided in that document. Now I understand as a lawyer one can argue if that only applied to NH Guilds purchased new after the acquisition happened, so I understand where you came from with your thoughts. Sometimes those documents are not written completely bullet proof...
Ralf

 

[hansmoust]

some hardcore Westerly Guild fans might shake their heads in dusgust at some Guild/Cordoba news.

The whole GAD line has been re-done, some new models, new cosmetics, headstocks along the Newark Street line look, Chesterfield inlays,....and in a move I find somewhat, well,...odd......the whole line has been re-christened "THE WESTERLY SERIES".

Well the Guild plant in Westerly was on Industrial Drive. So the "Industrial Drive Collection" doesn't really have much of a ring to it.

I understand the using the Westerly name, and it does honor the heritage, but I have to agree it will be confusing.

Well, to be honest, I never understood the reasoning behind the 'Newark Street Collection’ name; after all, the Hoboken plant was on Observer Highway and Newark Street was more or less 'around the corner'. If Guild would follow that logic, then 'round the corner' from Industrial Drive would be Canal Street.
Maybe they should call it the 'Canal Street Collection’. People would immediately understand where the instruments come from since 'Canal Street' already has that 'Far-East' ring to it!

Canal Street was the entrance to the Holland Tunnel and the Holland Tunnel would get you straight to Hoboken, NJ. Hey…… marketing these days is all about associations! ‘Historically Correct’ went out the door some time ago!

Just an idea!

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

 

[Bronsky]

If Ren was still with Gibson, I wonder what he'd think about them coming out with a Chinese built line of Gibson acoustics called "The Bozeman Collection"? Or, maybe "The Kalamazoo Collection"?

This post helped me put this all in perspective.
Either people have never heard of Kalamazoo, and those who know what it is just know it's been closed for a while and no guitar is coming out of there.

The same goes for Westerly. To those who have never heard about it, it's just a word.
And for those who know what westerly means, I don't think there can be a confusion since there has since been Corona, Tacoma, New Hartford and soon Oxnard.

Here's another analogy ; for those of you who bought an Orpheum series, how many actually thought they were buying an early 20th century mandolin? :friendly_wink:

 

[jcwu]

Here's another analogy ; for those of you who bought an Orpheum series, how many actually thought they were buying an early 20th century mandolin? :friendly_wink:

Yeah, that was me. Imagine my surprise when I opened the box!!!

 

[Nomad Sivad]

Why no prototypes for the new guitars at namm or musikmesse ?

 

[chazmo]

Why no prototypes for the new guitars at namm or musikmesse ?

Welcome aboard.

According to what we heard here, the Oxnard facility is still awaiting permitting/licensing to produce guitars.

 

[charliea]

Welcome aboard.

According to what we heard here, the Oxnard facility is still awaiting permitting/licensing to produce guitars.

From what I read, the way to get something done in California is to put your proposition on the ballot. Maybe they'll try that next time around. It's probably faster!

 

[dapmdave]

Here's another analogy ; for those of you who bought an Orpheum series, how many actually thought they were buying an early 20th century mandolin? :friendly_wink:

Maybe that explains why those danged mandolin strings are too short!

But seriously, we know there were guitars, too...

 

[Dadaist]

It's just gonna be confusing. If they're keeping with the Newark Street theme, then figure out what street Westerly was on and name it the "_________ Street Collection". But don't name it by a factory name. Then things get so confusing. This is a really dumb idea..... what a shame.

Why didn't they run it by us first?

As I'm reading the responses in this thread to Cordoba's decision to attach a label that most of us hold near and dear, you've have look at this from their marketing viewpoint. They're in the business of selling new guitars. They're concerned about the history of Guild only if it translates into sales. If their marketing guys can mine the past by debasing the Westerly name and slapping it on a MIC guitar, sadly, it's going to happen. The automotive industry has been doing this for years. I'm not sure if a Pontiac LeMans ever raced at the fabled French race course, but you get the idea.

I agree with Tom, it would have been nice to have Cordoba get a little input from a loyal group of folks with decades of experience. I hope that this isn't a precursor of things to come.

David