Titan, deep water tourism catastrophe confirmed...Titantic

[Westerly Wood]

Missing Titanic sub passengers "have sadly been lost," OceanGate says as U.S. Coast Guard confirms implosion

The U.S. Coast Guard said the sub experienced a "catastrophic loss of the pressure chamber," and confirmed that a debris field found on the sea floor was pieces of the missing sub.

www.cbsnews.com

I been following this a bit, pretty sad. The sub imploded due to the pressure. 1600 ft from the Titanic, the pressure down there must be unreal.

 

[walrus]

Awful, but not surprising, news. RIP.

walrus

 

[Minnesota Flats]

Only consolation: they probably didn't even have time to realize what was happening.

 

[Westerly Wood]

Only consolation: they probably didn't even have time to realize what was happening.

I have been wondering how it would have happened, an implosion. Without getting morbid here or graphic, can someone explain what that is? Like basically being crushed instantly?

 

[davidbeinct]

At that depth as soon as there’s any kind of breach of the hull the pressure differential can no longer be maintained. Really rough back of the envelope calculation it’s a half psi per foot of water.

 

[GAD]

There is a well-known diving disaster that for your own sanity you should not google where explosive decompression of 9ATM lead to instant (though gruesome) death. Titanic is at *375*ATM. Assuming the sub failed at 300ATM, that’s 4400PSI. Car tires (which can be dangerous if they explode) are generally at about 35PSI. Propane tanks are between 100-200PSI. There is an absolutely unbelievable amount of pressure that deep in the ocean.

Another way to view it: Many pressure washers (which are more dangerous than many people realize) puts out 4400 PSI (at least ours does) and that’s through a pinhole (1-2mm). Imagine that much pressure from everywhere all at once. It would have been instantaneous.

 

[Minnesota Flats]

I have been wondering how it would have happened, an implosion. Without getting morbid here or graphic, can someone explain what that is? Like basically being crushed instantly?

Implosion (mechanical process) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[GGJaguar]

High quality video of the Titanic taken by an ROV (unmanned) is good enough for me. I'm not sure why someone would need to see it in person given the risks.

 

[Minnesota Flats]

Water pressure at the depth of the Titanic wreck is estimated to be 6,000 PSI or 400 atmospheres. At the surface, it's only about 15 PSI.

 

[West R Lee]

I've been following it rather intently, having worked many years with enormous amounts of pressure. From what I gather, around 6000 psi at that depth, slightly under that actually, at a bit over 5800 psi. And without getting morbid Wood, I actually took the time to read a couple of studies regarding that type of death. Obviously, and thankfully, it was instantaneous. But remarkably, according to one of those studies, though anything inside their bodies containing air or gas was instantly crushed, their bodies remained intact, unless damaged due to the trauma of the material with which the sub was made. The part of the study that I found most fascinating is that with that immense pressure (anything subjected to pressure heats up) , there was a millisecond in which the air was actually superheated by the enormous pressure change.

So thankfully, they never felt a thing, and their bodies may very well remain intact in a watery grave. Probably more than you may have wanted to know.

And it may be just me, but when I see something like this happen, my first thought is........well, you wanted to climb Mt. Everest, you knew there was a risk, and that was part of the appeal to your adventurous side. I do feel sorry for their loved ones, but they knew, or should have known what could happen.

West

 

[GAD]

I have been wondering how it would have happened, an implosion. Without getting morbid here or graphic, can someone explain what that is? Like basically being crushed instantly?

Correct. Unfathomable pressure from every direction at the same instant.

Think of a vacuum tube or even a lightbulb. Even the smallest crack will ruin the vessel because nature abhors a vacuum. The "pop" you hear when a lighbulb breaks is the air rushing in to fill the space previously devoid of air. Thunder is the same phenomenon where air has been ionized by lightening, thus causing an extreme low-pressure void. At the depths we're talking about, the inside of the submersible may as well be vacuum because the pressure differential is 400:1.

Edit - apparently it is now believed that thunder is a shockwave in the air due to the sudden thermal expansion of plasma in the lightening channel. Neat. (source).

 

[Westerly Wood]

Water pressure at the depth of the Titanic wreck is estimated to be 6,000 PSI or 400 atmospheres. At the surface, it's only about 15 PSI.

And I hear the Titan was not under any regulatory body re how solid or sound it had to be to reach that depth.

 

[Westerly Wood]

Correct. Unfathomable pressure from every direction at the same instant.

Think of a vacuum tube or even a lightbulb. Even the smallest crack will ruin the vessel because nature abhors a vacuum. At the depths we're talking about, the inside of the submersible may as well be vacuum because the pressure differential is 400:1.

Did they just not test the sub for this? I figure there would be rigorous testing of that kind of pressure. Carbon fiber. Is that even strong enough for that depth? Or is this just experimental and you know the danger going in but somehow try not to think about it.

 

[Westerly Wood]

I've been following it rather intently, having worked many years with enormous amounts of pressure. From what I gather, around 6000 psi at that depth, slightly under that actually, at a bit over 5800 psi. And without getting morbid Wood, I actually took the time to read a couple of studies regarding that type of death. Obviously, and thankfully, it was instantaneous. But remarkably, according to one of those studies, though anything inside their bodies containing air or gas was instantly crushed, their bodies remained intact, unless damaged due to the trauma of the material with which the sub was made. The part of the study that I found most fascinating is that with that immense pressure (anything subjected to pressure heats up) , there was a millisecond in which the air was actually superheated by the enormous pressure change.

So thankfully, they never felt a thing, and their bodies may very well remain intact in a watery grave. Probably more than you may have wanted to know.

And it may be just me, but when I see something like this happen, my first thought is........well, you wanted to climb Mt. Everest, you knew there was a risk, and that was part of the appeal to your adventurous side. I do feel sorry for their loved ones, but they knew, or should have known what could happen.

West

Ah yes, their organs would be crushed. Like in outer space. Man. This is tough.

 

[twocorgis]

And it may be just me, but when I see something like this happen, my first thought is........well, you wanted to climb Mt. Everest, you knew there was a risk, and that was part of the appeal to your adventurous side. I do feel sorry for their loved ones, but they knew, or should have known what could happen.

West

Not to sound insensitive Jim, but those were my thoughts exactly. And I guess that if you have to go, there are far worse ways for that to happen. They never knew what hit them.

 

[Teleguy61]

Did they just not test the sub for this? I figure there would be rigorous testing of that kind of pressure. Carbon fiber. Is that even strong enough for that depth? Or is this just experimental and you know the danger going in but somehow try not to think about it.

Lots of articles about the company, their safety consciousness or lack thereof, and possibly shortened testing.
Lawsuits to follow I assume.

 

[fronobulax]

Did they just not test the sub for this? I figure there would be rigorous testing of that kind of pressure. Carbon fiber. Is that even strong enough for that depth? Or is this just experimental and you know the danger going in but somehow try not to think about it.

As noted, there are suggestions that the company knew the sub could be made safer and chose not to do so. There is also, at this moment, no real regulation in place and even if there were, how would they be enforced in international waters?

Don't forget that diving on the Titanic is not good for the wreck site. Even if it wasn't a mass grave there is a case that it should not be a tourist attraction.

 

[West R Lee]

Lots of articles about the company, their safety consciousness or lack thereof, and possibly shortened testing.
Lawsuits to follow I assume.

There actually was a lawsuit, brought by one of their engineers who kept bringing the structural integrity of the vessel to light, and he was eventually terminated. But again, they knew the risks, or should have known. There was a long discussion of the "waivers" they sign to board the thing. Apparently, "implosion" was mentioned in that waiver.

West

 

[mavuser]

just bad mojo all around.

lots of rumours flying. while i'm sure they are all essentially true, not my place to share what is not confirmed.

I will say that is an odd way to spend such riches. I would do a lot of other things first. RIP

 

[West R Lee]

just bad mojo all around.

lots of rumours flying. while i'm sure they are all essentially true, not my place to share what is not confirmed.

I will say that is an odd way to spend such riches. I would do a lot of other things first. RIP

You could buy a lot of guitars for $250,000.

West