Westerly Collection Disappearing?

[GGJaguar]

And re the prevalence of discontinued 'bursts I even wondered if perhaps there was a supply issue with dyes?

In addition to the pigments, sunburst finishes require more labor to shoot and the person spraying a sunburst finish needs to be experienced and a bit of an artist to do it right. Maybe discontinuing sunburst finishes is simply a cost saving measure.

 

[geoguy]

As I wrote in a previous post, the sunburst appears to be available on several guitars, but only along with a pickup:

D-55E in antique sunburst
F-55E in antique sunburst
F-512E in antique sunburst

But that finish option isn't shown for the F-512 Maple, either with or without a pickup.



Also, when you search on Guild's website for "F-55 Maple", the version with a pickup appears to still be available:

F-55E Maple natural

So, perhaps they are simply paring down the options a bit, based on what sells best.

 

[merlin6666]

I stopped by my guitar store today. They are Guild dealer so I thought I ask how they were doing. Apparently they were selling very poorly and haven't ordered any new ones for some time. I saw only 4 Guilds in the shop, including a D20 which they had since the model was released. On the other hand they had probably around 15 Eastmans which apparently sell quickly, and they also seem to be the only company without supply issues that can easily ship new models.

 

[davismanLV]

I can see them doing something like "only a burst with pickup" which is an option and more money. It's kinda like options packages on cars. Oh you can get leather seats but it comes with the sunroof and the towing package. It's pooling options to make more money. That makes sense..... sorta. Or at least I'm USED to people doing this.

 

[SFIV1967]

As I wrote in a previous post, the sunburst appears to be available on several guitars, but only along with a pickup:

D-55E in antique sunburst
F-55E in antique sunburst
F-512E in antique sunburst

But that finish option isn't shown for the F-512 Maple, either with or without a pickup.



Also, when you search on Guild's website for "F-55 Maple", the version with a pickup appears to still be available:

F-55E Maple natural

So, perhaps they are simply paring down the options a bit, based on what sells best.

Fair enough, Sweetwater for instance lists both Maple and Rosewood in ATB but have no inventory of them, Chicago Music Exchange on the other hand has inventory of both without the pickups, and 2021 serial numbers!



Ralf

 

[fronobulax]

I can see them doing something like "only a burst with pickup" which is an option and more money. It's kinda like options packages on cars. Oh you can get leather seats but it comes with the sunroof and the towing package. It's pooling options to make more money. That makes sense..... sorta. Or at least I'm USED to people doing this.

Some folks from Guild commented on The Great Strap Button debate at one of the LMGs. They believed that people who wanted factory electronics also wanted to play standing up so the options were paired. There was a similar belief about cutaways although the correlation was not quite as strong. But for a brief period if you wanted a Guild from NH with a strap button, factory electronics or a cutaway you got all three.

Decades ago consumers bought what was made and most choices were made by the manufacturer. Then Burger King said "Have it your way" and computers and supply chain management made it easier to allow customers to make some choices. The pendulum may have swung too far as anyone who has stood in line at a specialty coffee shop can attest, but there remains a general expectation that companies will offer consumers choices. If your product, or manufacturing and logistics, can't really affordably support "build on demand" the next best thing is to offer a lot of choices and phase models in and out. I think that is what is driving the "catalog" of Guilds that are not made in the USA.

I'm not sure what is driving the Oxnard choices but if someone said Oxnard was limited by employee health, pandemic provisions and wood supply and used that to explain what they are, and are not, building and selling now, I'd be inclined to believe it.

 

[merlin6666]

I think that Frono is on to something with consumer choice. I actually have a dislike for all these options and choices and often when I buy something, even when dining out I pick the brand or restaurant that has fewest options. Just give me something the way it's supposed to be done and don't make me do the work designing it. I admired Martin guitars when there was a D18, D28, D35, D42, and D45 and your wallet could decide which one to get. Now with what seems like dozens of variations of each of these models I don't even bother looking at a Martin and will not bother with them. Same goes with Gibson and Fender that suffer from even worse option bloat.

 

[GAD]

I believe there have been studies that show we’re much happier with fewer options. Now we have not only seemingly endless options, but we feel inclined to research the option we like to make sure it’s got good reviews! It’s exhausting.

I rebelled against this one when we bought a water cooler (a bubbler for you New Englanders) for the kitchen. I decided I’d just get the one that looked good and not stress about it!

it was a noisy obnoxious piece of junk that lasted a year before getting replaced. Sigh…

 

[davismanLV]

As Gary says above, I just read a study that was done showing how MORE choices and options actually make people way more STRESSED!! And I can see that. I know how some people are with restaurant menus and coming to a decision in a normal place. For a (short) while I worked at Grand Lux Cafe at the Venetian. It's owned and modeled after Cheesecake Factory, same company. If you've ever looked at one of their menus it's like FIVE huge pages with more choices than anyone should ever have. I've had someone still 45 minutes after everyone's decided just going into meltdown because it's just too much for them to process and they get SO UPSET just making a basic decision for ONE MEAL!!

 

[adorshki]

I believe there have been studies that show we’re much happier with fewer options.

Yeah when I sold cars we called it "too many choices paralysis": Y'just got 20 new Caravans with identical option packages (proven to be the single biggest seller) and 1-3 of 'em in every color.

And your prospect stands at the end of a row of product trying to decide which color they want. To test drive.
(Actually this is good, it means they're visualizing themselves owning the vehicle. But it's, uh, aggravating.....)

TO be fair, packaged options allow a maker to achieve some economy of scale in manufacturing and components cost.

Decades ago consumers bought what was made and most choices were made by the manufacturer.

To be fair typically the choices offered were what had proven to be the most popular.

If your product, or manufacturing and logistics, can't really affordably support "build on demand" the next best thing is to offer a lot of choices and phase models in and out.

Car makers have grappled with the problem for at least 40 years. In the early '90's none of the big 3 and many of the Japanese imports offered anything but "packages" with some stand-alones that could be added or substituted. Anything that had to be done at the factory (Basically anything but bolt-on accessories) had to be ordered which dealers are loath to do, too much chance of customer changing mind, even with a hefty deposit, and dealer orders once placed are virtually non-cancellable unless within maybe 24-72 hours, after that, it's already in the production schedule and you'll take it, Mr. Dealer. Finding a buyer is your problem.

And it could be a purple Corvette with a tow package. Only the guy who ordered it and backed out when it got too far overdue will ever want that monstrosity.

I sold exactly one car to order in 4 years or so.

As Gary says above, I just read a study that was done showing how MORE choices and options actually make people way more STRESSED!! And I can see that. I know how some people are with restaurant menus and coming to a decision in a normal place. For a (short) while I worked at Grand Lux Cafe at the Venetian. It's owned and modeled after Cheesecake Factory, same company. If you've ever looked at one of their menus it's like FIVE huge pages with more choices than anyone should ever have. I've had someone still 45 minutes after everyone's decided just going into meltdown because it's just too much for them to process and they get SO UPSET just making a basic decision for ONE MEAL!!

It's not in business anymore, is it? Neither is the pizza place that gave you crust, cheese, and sauce for free and offered 50 different toppings, build your own.


Gimme a good 'ol fashioned ice cream parlor.. even Baskin Robbins' 28 flavors is overkill.

 

[Walter Broes]

Right this moment is a very weird time to draw a lot of conclusions. The pandemic has made for record sales in the musical instrument industry, and every manufacturer I know of is severely backordered because of the combination of exceptionally high demand and covid related production and supply problems.

Even vintage dealers complain they're running out of inventory!

I wouldn't read too much into it. Maybe CMG is just taking things off the website they just can't realistically supply for a year, who knows?

 

[Big.Al]

Well, I emailed Cordoba today and inquired about the status of the D-20, D-120, the OM-120, and the lack of many 100 series guitars on their website.

The response was that the mahogany topped 20 and 120 models are still active but currently out of stock. They also explained that many of the 100 series were off their website due to website maintenance.

There has been some interesting discussion and speculation here on this topic but I should probably have just emailed Cordoba in the first place. They were really helpful.

 

[davismanLV]

Car dealerships are dealing with the same thing. They have NO inventory and not exactly sure when more will come. My nieces boyfriend just bought a new Nissan Pathfinder (the new 2022 model is super nice!!) and he said there's no cars to buy and the used market is even worse!! Things should change soon, though we're all back to masks full time here because the new cases and variant are making inroads and the hospitals are full again. Hoooo boy!!!

 

[chazmo]

^ Hey, Tom, I was going to trade my Miata in for a new one and there are none around The automotive supply chain is disrupted particuluarly because they cannot get the electronics they need. The whole international supply chain is a real mess right now. Don't buy any cars for a while!

 

[Rayk]

I love Guild but I will say this for American builds . We love the good O’l days but I feel Guild needs to step up with some new models and designs .
Other companies are moving on that especially Eastman and starting early 22 Bourgeois and Eastman will put out there new collaboration line called Touch Stone .
4A tops OM’s I believe. Just two to start EIR and African Mahogany I believe .
Even Recording king is putting out higher end guitars at affordable prices.
Some are incorporating arm bevels and sound ports etc ; add beautiful woods and stain options and you get attention.
Breedlove is rocking on that !
Everyone sells the plain Jane models .
I wish I seen more advertising from them as well .
I don’t know maybe I’m nuts . lol
I played my OM 120 yesterday . It’s a great guitar it has fantastic tone ! Ugh … want to sell it you have to put it out there and push it , it’s not a “build it and they will come “ thing anymore .
With the sunburst the standard sunburst to me it’s to old school . I can understand that not selling to much .
Ok didn’t want get anyone mad just saying what I think .

 

[chazmo]

Interesting comments, above, about marketing and reduced choices. I definitely agree about the general mindset of too many choices being problematic for a majority of buyers. Not to mention buying limits and inventory for dealers who don't want to have to stock different models with various levels of trim in their stores.

Speaking about the high-end, Oxnard-built products... perhaps the ultimate plan is to do a custom shop. GSRs are I guess a good intermediate step, but why not have a custom shop for all the orders from people who know exactly what they want. I think that's worked very well for Taylor and Martin in the past.

Oh, about the earlier comment about Martin offering too many choices due to necks and bracing, I think it'd be very interesting to get a Martin follower's comment on that. As a hugely successful company, I wonder how they've managed all that inventory for their dealers.

I'll try not to beat a dead horse here, but if they're actually dropping the F-50 model from the line-up, I think that'd be tough on the Guild brand.

 

[Westerly Wood]

Speaking about the high-end, Oxnard-built products... perhaps the ultimate plan is to do a custom shop. GSRs are I guess a good intermediate step, but why not have a custom shop for all the orders from people who know exactly what they want. I think that's worked very well for Taylor in the past.

This is a brilliant idea Chaz, and might go a long way to "save" the brand or give it a longer life than anticipated.

 

[chazmo]

^ I'm just wondering if this is where it's headed, Woody. It seems to make sense to me. What doesn't make sense is making the various trim levels unavailable if it means sales... The reason I say this is because the Oxnard products are Guild's premium stuff, and people want what they want! Many guitar players I know are VERY picky.

 

[Rayk]

Heck one thing I don’t get is where are OM’s for Pete’s sake ? Talk about a hole not filled .

 

[Nuuska]

Heck one thing I don’t get is where are OM’s for Pete’s sake ? Talk about a hole not filled .

I can see them - they're just mingled between other gits