WTB WTB Guild Acoustic Sub $400

If you can make the drive to Prescott Valley AZ, there is this D25 for 500: https://prescott.craigslist.org/msg/d/guild-acoustic/6215516161.html

Tempe has this Guild F25, which looks really cool and is 475: https://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/msg/d/guild-gf/6188380761.html

gjmalcyon said:

I sent the seller a friendly email and he corrected the listing and included a pic of the label (at my suggestion) to more clearly show the country of origin.

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Saw the correction, didn't even remember (if I ever knew) they made the GAD40 in cutaway, thought it had to be one of the "100" series.
It's funny, the only reason I looked at it was because US D40c's are pretty rare, otherwise it might have got by.

Maloburro I just sent you a PM so check your messages when you get a chance.

Have a good one!

TX

A new post on Reverb; "Excellent" condition D4 for $449.
https://reverb.com/item/6207841-guild-d4-acoustic-natural

Or "Good" for $398.
https://reverb.com/item/6200843-goo...ild-westerly-usa-guitar-d4-nt-with-guild-ohsc

AcornHouse said:

A new post on Reverb; "Excellent" condition D4 for $449.
https://reverb.com/item/6207841-guild-d4-acoustic-natural

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Man, that does look good. I mean excellent. Plenty of saddle. That case is worth 100 bucks easy. And it has "make offer." I bet he'd take $400 in a snap.

Cougar said:

Man, that does look good. I mean excellent. Plenty of saddle. That case is worth 100 bucks easy. And it has "make offer." I bet he'd take $400 in a snap.

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Yeah, even if they hold out for the $450.00 it's still worth the extra $50.00 compared to the other one, which also has plenty of saddle but is already a 1/32 high at 12th fret (factory set-up was 3/32 max but looks like a full 1/8"), and has a coupla other issues: no heelcap (thus neck can wick humiidty), and looks like strap button's broken off inside hole? Could be a real p.i.t.a. to get out.

I believe I'd take a pass on the $398 one - but the seller did take the effort to show the action
at 12th fret - not enough sellers do!

Bonneville88 said:

I believe I'd take a pass on the $398 one - but the seller did take the effort to show the action
at 12th fret - not enough sellers do!

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Yes, with the appropriate warning to be sure to view the pics, too.
To be applauded, for sure.
At a little bit better price that actually might be a great deal for one of us looking for a campfire guit or slight fixer-upper, I just thought the other one would be a better choice for the OP's first Guild.
:friendly_wink:

I'd jump on that first one.

I have a friend with a D4 that is just a fantastic-sounding guitar (better than my D25). Each instrument is unique, of course. But there's a lot of potential in the D4.

Have owned 2 D4s (still have one) and 3 D25s (still have all)...
IME the D25s have a little more "something"... sonic character?...
than the D4s... but the 4's are good too.

I may be wrong in this impression but the D4's have seemed a bit
lighter weight than the D25s, although I don't know why they would be.
May have to get into a guitar weighing session on this to see if it bears scrutiny.

Finish on the D4s is a low gloss, toward the flatter side of satin, the D25s are high gloss.

Interesting and a bit puzzling to scan the current asking price range on both these guitars on
Reverb, ebay, CL, GC... found a "great condition" D4 for $449 at GC (as of this posting GC
has 13 (!) D25s of various eras for sale in a pretty wide price range), also looked at
a 70's D25 at Gruhn, described as "functional" but needing quite a bit of work considering
the asking price.

Pricing sure seems to run the gamut on these two models from reasonable to ridiculous.
As noted earlier, very few sellers providing clear info on 12th fret string action.

Bonneville88 said:

Have owned 2 D4s (still have one) and 3 D25s (still have all)...
IME the D25s have a little more "something"... sonic character?...
than the D4s... but the 4's are good too.

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I'd chalk that up to individual variations between instruments and also build eras, I can't see/remember what the vintages are on your D25's.
W-a-a-y back around the time I joined, one of the guys who worked in Westerly (Was it Hideglue?, otherwise think it was WorkedinWesterly) said "All D4s started off as D25s" which seemed backwards to me at the time, but now I think he meant the basic superstructure/top/neck assemblies which all would have been the same, but early D4's didn't get headstock faceplates or back binding, so that might be a couple of ounces right there.

Bonneville88 said:

I may be wrong in this impression but the D4's have seemed a bit
lighter weight than the D25s, although I don't know why they would be.
May have to get into a guitar weighing session on this to see if it bears scrutiny.

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Again, I suspect build era is relevant.
D4's were launched in '91-'92 when Guild seemed to be going back to lighter builds, and had been working on DV build techniques for a little while already, which included sanding backs and sides for better resonance.
Maybe some of that rubbed off on the rest of the line? (So to speak)
Another telling detail is that while D4's got their own s/n sequence in '91-'93, in '94 they started using the "AD04xxxx" sequence and starting in '95 D25's were using the exact same sequence, too.:
http://guildguitars.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/history_of_your_guild.pdf
You actually can't tell a D25 from a D4 by s/n after '94, you have to have the instrument in hand to see the build details (Unless Hans has records detailing which were which)

Bonneville88 said:

Finish on the D4s is a low gloss, toward the flatter side of satin, the D25s are high gloss.

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That was the standard finish, it was an NCL gel applied by hand and rubbed in, thus the "HR" finish designation.
According to the '97 catalog the HR finish was lighter so there's another tiny bit of weight difference.
And just to keep things interesting, the D4 eventually got all the appointments of the D25 including a HG finish (announced in '97 but I seem to recall earlier examples)
The D4 also seemed to be Guild's test bed for unusual finishes, we've seen quite a few in just the last couple of years including a "Black burst" with an unusual black pearloid guard and 2 other shades of 'burst with unusual pickguard colors to match:

(even the TRC was pearloid on that one)
More photos here:
https://reverb.com/au/item/3921387-guild-d4-1995-silver-burst
And a blue one (and the black one too) in this thread:
http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...ral stained sides and backs.) :friendly_wink:

Thank you all for the great info. Sorry I was down in southern California for a family function, actively checking CL to no avail. I will check those two on Reverb and also the one on GC. I thought again about the D4 I called on earlier with the neck reset at GC for $350, maybe if they took 300 it might be worth the risk.

While I'm not sure a 12 string is what I want, this popped up and looks interesting. It's about 2 hours away and I would HAVE to go through Lake Tahoe to check it out. Poor poor pitiful me right? https://reno.craigslist.org/msg/d/1980s-guild-12-string-electric/6246208923.html

TX, thanks for the PM on the Reverb info. I will probably make an offer.

AL, thanks for posting those crazy D4 finishes, that's just what my GAS needed. Now I'm thinking I should hold out for something crazy like that just to be different. There was a blue Gretsch Dread on eBay for cheap, Korean Historic but cool nonetheless. I was tempted, but I'm trying to stay strong like you've all suggested.

The teacher who leads singing at our school plays a Seagull with the satin vintage burst finish, so a natural finish would be fine. But man a black or blue burst sure would be cool. The D4 listed as excellent looks like a music shop so I'll try to email them and see if they can give me a reading on the 12th fret. That's probably the most promising listing I've seen so far. Thanks again for everyone's help with this.

Update... Also saw this pop up. I like the idea since I'm a product of the mid 70s as well. It's pretty.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Guild-D44M-...201497?hash=item33d44dd059:g:uMgAAOSw7GRZBnld

So it brought up a thought. As I was reading that Guild neck resets can be marginally more difficult and costly than other brands, if a Guild has been reset once, would that make the job somewhat easier the next time?

FWIW, I'm not so interested in excellent appearance as I am decent playability. All I'm mostly doing for the time being is chording in the cowboy pocket (at least when I'm playing to 6th graders), so it brings up the issue of cost vs condition vs mojo. If a nice vintage piece came along that needs attention later, it might be ok. Just a thought.

Thanks again.

Ryan

Maloburro said:

While I'm not sure a 12 string is what I want, this popped up and looks interesting. It's about 2 hours away and I would HAVE to go through Lake Tahoe to check it out. Poor poor pitiful me right? https://reno.craigslist.org/msg/d/1980s-guild-12-string-electric/6246208923.html

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If dating's correct, it's a D-212 or D25-12, different names for a 12-string D25.
Looks like factory volume/tone knobs, just don't ever recall seeing the lead visible through the soundhole like that before.
Not even sure what they were using then, think it might be a little early for Fishman UST which became the standard by early '90's at least.
Label should read "D2512e" (or D212e) if that's a factory installation.
Reports are that the technology of the era can be disappointing compared to modern stuff. (If it is a Fishman it might actually sound pretty decent)
Assuming bridge's ok (no lift, no belly) and no other issues, $575 with case sounds like a pretty darn good deal for a Guild 12-er.
Be aware 12-string necks are kinda wide and flat but if you're looking primarily for a strummer you might be real happy.
Also noticed saddle looks a little wonky, like higher on treble side than bass, and low on bass side besides.
Can tell it's not original because it's compensated, but maybe the guy just likes an unusual set-up.

Maloburro said:

Update... Also saw this pop up. I like the idea since I'm a product of the mid 70s as well. It's pretty.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Guild-D44M-...201497?hash=item33d44dd059:g:uMgAAOSw7GRZBnld

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That is a maple-bodied D44. I see some warning signs: Crack in top, need to verify it's been cleataed properly.
Action does look pretty high, saddle looks kinda low on treble side, but most of all what's that drip coming out of the heel right underneath the fretboard?
Never seen that on a re-set job before.
And it doesn't look like hideglue, let's hope to heaven it ain't epoxy.
It'll never come back apart.

Maloburro said:

So it brought up a thought. As I was reading that Guild neck resets can be marginally more difficult and costly than other brands, if a Guild has been reset once, would that make the job somewhat easier the next time?

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That would depend entirely on the quality of the first reset.
Assuming joint was cleaned up properly and hideglue used again, possibly marginally easier.
If reset with a resin glue lie Tote-bond, might be easier yet, that stuff breaks loose at lower temp, more quickly, but Guild used hide-glue throughout Westerly production, as it's got the best "creep resistance" of all woodworking glues.
But that's one of the things that makes 'em a little tough to break loose sometimes.
The flip side of the coin is that if the neck's been reset once, it may not need another one during your ownership lifetime.
I figure minimum 20-year service life using light gauge strings, and we've got guys here with 30+ year old guitars that haven't needed one yet.

Maloburro said:

FWIW, I'm not so interested in excellent appearance as I am decent playability. All I'm mostly doing for the time being is chording in the cowboy pocket (at least when I'm playing to 6th graders), so it brings up the issue of cost vs condition vs mojo. If a nice vintage piece came along that needs attention later, it might be ok. Just a thought.

Thanks again.

Ryan

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Given that, I'd ask the guy with the 12-er if he can show you a neck alignment photo (Ruler extended from fretboard to bridge) and action at 12th (should be 6/64 max with a saddle height of roughly 1/8" (higher would even be better, up to about 5/32, then there's plenty of room for lowering.
I'm kinda leery about that D44, no matter how pretty that back is....

Thanks for the detailed post Al, I really appreciate it. I emailed the shop with the "excellent" D4 on Reverb and asked for a 12th fret measurement. I'll do the same on the 12 string, I'll give that guy a call since that's what he asked for. Like you said about the 12er being a bit wider at the nut, that was what I was thinking too and from the pictures, it does look wide at the nut. The two dreads I had that I sold were fairly wide compared to the AJ I have. I have to say I like the AJ's narrow neck, it's got a bit of a v shape to the back which I've always liked, and feels quite like an electric. Preferable to me. That being said, it doesn't mean I wouldn't get on with a wider neck if it were a 12 string. I think what I'll do is try to get down to GC and play a random 12 string to see how I like it.

If the Reverb D4 checks out, I'll probably offer $400 + shipping. That seems fair.

Maloburro said:

That being said, it doesn't mean I wouldn't get on with a wider neck if it were a 12 string. I think what I'll do is try to get down to GC and play a random 12 string to see how I like it.

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Guild's nut width spec for 12-ers was always 1-13/16, 1/16 wider than a 1-3/4 nut.
They're also "chunky" in part due to the presence of 2 truss rods.
The dual rods allow compensation for the higher string tension on the bass strings, to prevent twisting.
I prefer a slightly narrower neck feel myself and for that I think the D-4 won't disappoint but it'll definitely be a shallow "C".
But I've got a buddy with a Guild JF30-12 and it doesn't take much "adjusting to" when I play it.
All this made me remember though, the dual rods in the 12-ers can be a little tricky to adjust, it might explain why the treble strings look so high.
I'd sight down the neck for obvious signs of twist and any sign of cracking along the grain lines on the back of the neck.
If found I'd have to turn it down.

Maloburro said:

Thanks for the detailed post Al, I really appreciate it. I emailed the shop with the "excellent" D4 on Reverb and asked for a 12th fret measurement.
...
If the Reverb D4 checks out, I'll probably offer $400 + shipping. That seems fair.

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Hope it works out for you - was playing the wife's D4 the other day and am reminded that I seriously considered it keeping for my herd and getting her something sparkly instead.

Ask for a photo of where the straightedge test lands per the frets.com link I posted earlier in this thread - that test has proven to be the most valuable one I use when evaluating used acoustic guitars. That photo should also give you an idea of the bridge and saddle height, and should alert you in case either bridge or saddle has been shaved.

Happy hunting.

Thanks GJ. I had already asked for string height so I will follow up and thanks for that link. He sent me a pic with a tape measure that wasn't too clear. He says 1/8 or less at 12th fret. I found a Guild dealer in the next town over so I'm going to try to stop by and see what they've got today. To be continued...

Stopped by the "Guild dealer" and they were transitioning between FMIC and Córdoba so they had nothing. They started talking about NAMM and I think I got some outside help I really didn't need.

Nevertheless, they were also a Martin and Godin dealer (Fender too) so they let me strum an S12 and I was challenged to decide if this would work for me. A 12er that is. It was well set up and tuned but odd for me at first. I think my problem is I like to bend, even when chording, which challenged my novice skills trying to hit chords exactly. I missed the 6 string.

So at least I made a determination today (after I spent 1.5 hours at the DMV renewing my license and sneaking to the record store to grab some good used stuff). I need a 6 for now and I'll look for an affordable 12 for fun.

Now here's where y'all might get mad at me. I found some good deals on CL today, including an A & L Spruce for $100 and some SD pickups. I'm supposed to meet them tomorrow so I'll update on how that goes. I've always been a fan of Bob Barker, so I couldn't resist.

By no means does this mean I'm off the Guild trail. More to the contrary. I'm thinking that D4 on reverb is the way to go but I'm going to see how tomorrow plays out and update.

Found one

So I found a D25 locally. $300 from 1987. It plays well. Has a few issues. Action is good and saddle isn't shaved. It has a crack in the back of the headstock which is not all the way through, looks like glue was wicked in to stabilize. I wasn't too worried about that. Also had a ding which caused splintering in the upper side of the body. I did not notice that til I got home. It has the typical binding pull then re glue. It's a definite relic. Had I noticed the body split I would have offered 260. It's not that bad though. Oh well. It plays nice and the neck feels good. A little more bass than the A&L I got. It came with a nice HSC though not a Guild case. I expected to get a deal but I think it's more of a fair price for what I got. At least at his price I can't complain too much. It has a lot of scrapes and bumps and bruises but it plays well.

Glad you found one! (Now, on to your second. )