Finally Home F612 NGD!!

davismanLV

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Surprisingly enough the F612 is relatively comfortable to play, You really don't notice the size difference unless you are looking for it.:rolleyes:
Or unless maybe you're Jane. She's not that big and I know plenty of people who would be overwhelmed by that size. I'm really surprised that you're okay with this huge guitar, Tx, with all your shoulder issues and all. I guess it's all individual. You pick them up and see how it works. Either way, if you're okay with it.... that's just good news all around!! :encouragement:
 

txbumper57

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No... I really wouldn't. It was made from .... what? 1971 to 1973? And only 6 at a whack? Maybe three times? So it's a guitar they made very few of, for only a few times, for very few years. But the qualification of "regular production" gets a little tricky, doesn't it? What would y'all consider "regular production"?? I need some input.....

My understanding was that The F612 was on the price sheet for 1972 labeled "Special Order" but it was not in the "Regular" Catalog. It was discontinued in the 73 Price list. The F512 didn't even become a regular Catalog item until 1974. Before that time they were also "Special Order" only Guitars according to Hans's Book.
 

chazmo

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I know that there is a Stigma with the Guild Jumbos and their size, Especially with the F612 being larger than a normal Guild Jumbo. Honestly The F612 plays as easy as my F512 or any of my Guild Dreads. There is no more advert stress playing the F612 than any other Guild I have owned or played in the standing or sitting position. My arm is not hurting this week due to the Guitar, I had a Doctors appointment on Tuesday where they pushed the shoulder past it's mobility limits in the Examination. This normally takes me a week to recover from and let the swelling subside. Surprisingly enough the F612 is relatively comfortable to play, You really don't notice the size difference unless you are looking for it.:rolleyes:
I don't think there's any stigma. It's just a fact that some people are uncomfortable with the jumbo's size, and of course the 18" F-612 is just more of the same. I don't have a particularly easy time sitting and playing my F-512 as my right arm drapes over the widest part of the guitar and that pushes the waist down into my right leg. I think the F-612 might be even harder.

John Denver was not a particuarly big guy, but I've only see him playing the F-612 standing up, and the thing completely covers his torso. :)

For those folks who find it a little challenging a stool works pretty well, and of course you can put a strap on it and play standing. Another option is to play classical style with the guitar waist on your left knee. In any case, I'm sure it's worth it to experience the F-612.
 

idealassets

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Yup, It was found in a dumpster with a broken neck I believe but all the pieces were there. I'm not sure if it was restored or not, Some one here on the forum may have more info on it as I believe it was a couple of years before I joined.
I admit to buying the dumpster 1972 F612 from the fellow who found it. It played nicely, and after keeping it nearly 2 years I sold it. Why? because too many luthiers did not agree with how I wanted to pay to have it repaired. This included a new top, which is a standard replacement size that can be ordered today.

It was identified by every luthier that saw it, that it was made with Brazilian rosewood. I don't know for that guitar since BRW comes in so many different patterns and colors. It would have been a great guitar to keep, but my premise was that if you put up all the $ to get it repaired, while you're doing that, why not get it totally back to optimum sound? Also why not get it repaired for final instead of having to keep tending to the other old Band-Aid repair jobs that might not have been done right? So, I let her go.
 
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idealassets

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p.s. the 72 F612 that I bought was probably the least expensive one sold in the last decade, since the seller later gave me a $600 refund off the ~$3800 selling price because the required repairs put the guitar in worse condition than what was described by Mandolin Bro.'s "rough repair estimate".
 

txbumper57

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Wow, I don't see how you sell that guitar regardless of the condition Idealassets. Must have been a real heartbreaker to let it go. As a 1972 was it certified Brazilian back and sides or Brazilian sides and East Indian Rosewood back?
 

idealassets

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Tx, Yes I regretted letting it go although I never bought it to re-sell it. The BRW was identified by more than one vintage guitar specialist who were all very interested in assisting. However for my repair work, all I heard was "But we prefer to work with the original tone woods" and "it will be worth more that way".

I have done luthier work where I totally replaced parts in very authentic fashion, and they were never criticized as being repaired as such. On the other hand, I never liked doing repairs on top of other older repairs, just to "keep it all original". But I had never replaced a top before, and preferred to find an expert do it for this F612. Most luthiers charge $90+/hr. to do the bare minimum, whereas I would often put in many hours unreimbursed on my own work. I was always interested in a great end product, especially considering that the goal was to bring a great old guitar back to the best state of sound and long term preservation.

The hardest part was in hearing even the former Guild repair bench in New Hartford wanting $150/hr. but would not agree to do what I was asking them to do, but instead they also proposed to "keep the original tone woods", which meant to keep all the old cracks still on the guitar.

I certainly do enjoy the enthusiasm of anyone that owns an F612. It is quite an event to own one of so few made. As for "my" F612 I played it a few times tuned to pitch, but for 2 years I left it tuned 1 1/2 steps down at C# and only played Paul Stookey's Wedding Song, which he did originally in that pitch.

But my plans were to play it at pitch, once the cracked wood was all replaced with an authentically crafted new top and new bracing.
 
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txbumper57

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I never bought this one to resell it, I wanted to be able to Play "The Mythical Beast" and let me tell you it is worth every bit. I am very lucky in that my Luthier is one of those guys who sees eye to eye with me on the balance between Originality and Functionality. He is also one of the most talented folks I know when it comes to the realm of repairs or Custom work. To have him work on my stuff is awesome. It doesn't matter if it is a $300 70's Takamine that I played on stage for years or a $30,000 Martin, He take the same care when he does a job. Not too mention being a licensed Guild dealer and Repair facility is a major plus!

I play mine at Concert pitch and will continue to do so. If repairs need to be made or something rears it's ugly head then so be it, It will get repaired in the proper way. My luthier told me he saw no problem with tuning it to standard pitch as everything is as solid as a rock!
 
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idealassets

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-I am amazed that all my Guild guitars sound great on light gage strings when tuned down 1 1/2 steps. Much lower than that and heavier strings are needed.
 

idealassets

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tx,
It appears that you have a great set up with your luthier. That's the great state of Texas for you. I hope that you like your DTAR's as much as I do. I hate to say it, but I love plugging in with them and playing amplified right after some other guitar player just ended his set. There is a fellow locally that plays a Collings, however he plays acoustic mic'd, which unfortunately doesn't always bring out his best.
 
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idealassets

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I never bought this one to resell it, I wanted to be able to Play "The Mythical Beast" and let me tell you it is worth every bit. I am very lucky in that my Luthier is one of those guys who sees eye to eye with me on the balance between Originality and Functionality. He is also one of the most talented folks I know when it comes to the realm of repairs or Custom work. To have him work on my stuff is awesome. It doesn't matter if it is a $300 70's Takamine that I played on stage for years or a $30,000 Martin, He take the same care when he does a job. Not too mention being a licensed Guild dealer and Repair facility is a major plus!

I play mine at Concert pitch and will continue to do so. If repairs need to be made or something rears it's ugly head then so be it, It will get repaired in the proper way. My luthier told me he saw no problem with tuning it to standard pitch as everything is as solid as a rock!

tx,
I can imagine your luthier was just a little enthusiastic about working on that F612, eh?
 

txbumper57

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tx,
I can imagine your luthier was just a little enthusiastic about working on that F612, eh?

That's what I love about Danny my Luthier. He doesn't get too high and he doesn't get too low. LOL. I'm always bringing him weird and interesting stuff to work on. It is really hard to get an Excited reaction out of him, I mean the two guitars he was working on before the F612 were full restorations on 2 pre war Martins. He did make a point to say when I went to pick it up that it was the coolest 12 string he had ever worked on and one hell of a guitar. That reaction is as good as I have ever seen. LOL :cool:
 

charliea

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I play mine at Concert pitch and will continue to do so. If repairs need to be made or something rears it's ugly head then so be it, It will get repaired in the proper way. My luthier told me he saw no problem with tuning it to standard pitch as everything is as solid as a rock!

Obviously, it's your guitar and you can tune it any way you like. To me the baritone 12's were made to tune down 3 half-steps, or more, with heavy strings. It's kinda their reason for existing. When you listen to Seeger or somebody playing one of the Martin PS 12s, they have that huge, low growl that the oversize 12 is all about. To me, that is. YMMV.

Additional info: Just checked Denver's Bells of Rhymney on Youtube. He's tuned down two halves.
 
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txbumper57

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Charlie I don't want you to take this the wrong way But I am not you and you are not me. I'm pretty sure we have different points of view Why a lot of things Exist. I'm not Denver, Never tried to be Denver, Never will be Denver. Just happy being me and playing the way I do. I appreciate the info and it has been noted, but personally I would never tell you what I think your Guitar exists to do or what it should be All about. Have a Nice Weekend Charlie.
 

shot put

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Hi- I think that is the coolest aspect of a 612- heavy strings tuned way down sounds great and lighter strings tuned at pitch sounds great as well. The longer scale length really changes the performance of the guitar. I have 2 custom shop guild 12's too and have the same string alterations on them without the dramatic tonal change-body width and scale length have to be the variables. There is also a huge difference in a 71 and 72 612 at least in my case. IMHO
 

txbumper57

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I'm curious Shot Put, What are the differences in your 1971 and 1972 F612's? Just cosmetic or do they have significantly different tone to them?
 

shot put

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Hi- The inlays are very different; the sound hole concentric circle inlays are different-pickguard one black one tortoise - sound and feel are completely different. Rosewood is very similar on both. Spruce on the 71 has much more silk. Both are very easy to play even with the longer scale. Both are much lighter than the 512 or jf55-12.
 

adorshki

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But the qualification of "regular production" gets a little tricky, doesn't it? What would y'all consider "regular production"?? I need some input.....
It means they built 'em for inventory based on anticipated demand, not only to order.
SO if a dealer placed an order for 2 or 3 each of 4 different "regular production" models (say, F20, D25, D40 and F50) chances are he'd get everything right "off the shelf" in a week or two. But if price list/catalog said "Special order", it meant they weren't gonna build it until they had an order.
So I don't think they built those things 6 at a time, even.
 
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