Double pickguard Guilds?

[adorshki]

In interviews, I've listened to Bruce Van Wart, Richard Hoover and Dana Bourgeois discuss graduating the outer edges of their guitar tops by hand. I'd also swear, but am not 100% sure that I've heard Ren Ferguson discuss it as well, or a similar process, but I sure could be wrong about that. What they are doing is simply thinning the top at the outer edges after planing and sanding to get more "response" or "excitability", whatever you wish to call it, out of that top. To me, in my laymen's terms, that simply mean to enable that top to achieve more vibration. From there it would seem that to glue a piece of plastic to that then "tuned" top might inhibit that vibration to some degree. To glue two pieces of plastic to a top? Well. I do know that some makers choose to use very thin material for pickguards for that reason.

The thinner edges allow more movement, allow the mass of the rest of the top to move. Note 'guards rarely extend to the edge of the top, and those that do look like amateur hacks. So they're not restricting motion in the critical area, they're just along for the ride on prt of the top that barely moves anyway.

Guild's "floating X" bracing, reserved for the highest level tops, also aid that edge flexibility by not extending the braces all the way to the edge of the top. In fact they even said in one of the later Guild Galleries they didn't use it on 17" tops because it would allow too much movement, tops that big didn't need the additional edge flexibility and it was counter-productive.

 

[Westerly Wood]

The thinner edges allow more movement, allow the mass of the rest of the top to move. Note 'guards rarely extend to the edge of the top, and those that do look like amateur hacks. So they're not restricting motion in the critical area, they're just along for the ride on prt of the top that barely moves anyway.

Guild's "floating X" bracing, reserved for the highest level tops, also aid that edge flexibility by not extending the braces all the way to the edge of the top. In fact they even said in one of the later Guild Galleries they didn't use it on 17" tops because it would allow too much movement, tops that big didn't need the additional edge flexibility and it was counter-productive.

literally, the extra PG impacts projection and tone in no way that is decipherable.

 

[adorshki]

Didn’t matter too much to some people.

Now those are "Marlows"

Guilds use "vests":

 

[adorshki]

Let's not forget Bonnie Raitt's famous F50 : )

Wit d' F30 bridge.

 

[Westerly Wood]

Wit d' F30 bridge.

a GSR? lol Oxnard.

 

[adorshki]

a GSR? lol Oxnard.

Nope, replaced at some point long ago, I just remember Hans pointing it out about 15 years ago or so. Readily ID'd due to no "points".

Speaking of Oxnard we ought-a assign somebody to watch out in case they try to unload the archback press. We should step in and crowd-fund a purchase and freight to GAD's place for safe-keeping if necessary.

 

[Westerly Wood]

Nope, replaced at some point long ago, I just remember Hans pointing it out about 15 years ago or so. Readily ID'd due to no "points".

Speaking of Oxnard we ought a assign somebody to watch out in case they try to unload the archback press. We should step in and crowd-fund a purchase and freight to GAD's place for safe-keeping if necessary.

Would be cool to have that press in my office.

 

[adorshki]

Would be cool to have that press in my office.

Got floor braces?

 

[Westerly Wood]

Got floor braces?

we do get some high winds here occasionally but that press should not go anywhere...

 

[adorshki]

we do get some high winds here occasionally but that press should not go anywhere...

Might still wanna place a few bottle jacks strategically around the foundation.

 

[banjomike]

Here's a double pickguard for ya...
Bob Shane was a reckless strummer, so this saved his D-28 from an early grave.

 

[West R Lee]

The thinner edges allow more movement, allow the mass of the rest of the top to move. Note 'guards rarely extend to the edge of the top, and those that do look like amateur hacks. So they're not restricting motion in the critical area, they're just along for the ride on prt of the top that barely moves anyway.

Guild's "floating X" bracing, reserved for the highest level tops, also aid that edge flexibility by not extending the braces all the way to the edge of the top. In fact they even said in one of the later Guild Galleries they didn't use it on 17" tops because it would allow too much movement, tops that big didn't need the additional edge flexibility and it was counter-productive.

I would agree Al. They say the vast majority of vibration comes from the lower bout top, so yes. And all of this is personal opinion, nothing that I've read or seen in a video or anything. I just think that unless you beat a guitar up with a pick, there's no real reason for double pickguards. But more than that. As mentioned in another thread a while back about solid colored guitars, and again just my personal preference, but I love wood grain. So to me, to cover that grain is a bit unsightly.......but again, just my opinion.

I was thinking about that specific thing last night......opinions. It occurred to me what the best guitar in the world is, and I know it for a fact. The BEST guitar is the guitar that is right for the individual, whether a $100 guitar or a $10,000 guitar, or maple or rosewood......it simply doesn't matter what I think or anyone else for that matter, it's all about personal preference........as in pickguards as well.

West

 

[kostask]

Acoustic flat top guitars are NOT acoustically "dead" ahead of the bridge by any means. The area ahead of the middle of the soundhole certainly is acoustically dead, no doubt. The tops of acoustic flat top guitars (as opposed to acoustic arch top guitars) generate sound when the bridge rocks back and forth. That means that the front of the bridge moves when the area behind the bridge moves, just in the opposite direction (i.e. the area in the front of the bridge moves down when the area behind the bridge moves up, and vice versa). So, in the theorectical sense, West R. Lee is absolutely correct. Anything that causes that motion in the area just ahead of the bridge to be restricted could cause an impact to the sound by stiffening that area, indirectly affecting the area behind the bridge. In the real world, I don't know that it is significant. Most pick guards are pretty thin, and not very stiff, so I don't know how much they restrict movement. The Harmony pick guards in the pictures above, however, are thick, as I wrote before, so suspect that they have more of an impact than most pick guards do, not to mention that they are covering up a lot of active surface area.

If you ever get a chance to hear a hand built guitar prior to it being finished (before even the pore filler is applied) it will amaze you how much louder and better the guitar sounds than after it is finished. Even with the thinnest of nitro finishes, it is significantly louder and better sounding than after the finishing.

 

[Sal]

Now those are "Marlows"

Guilds use "vests":

Guild uses "Derek Smalls" (formerly of the band formerly known as Spinal Tap)

 

[adorshki]

I would agree Al. They say the vast majority of vibration comes from the lower bout top, so yes. And all of this is personal opinion, nothing that I've read or seen in a video or anything. I just think that unless you beat a guitar up with a pick, there's no real reason for double pickguards. But more than that. As mentioned in another thread a while back about solid colored guitars, and again just my personal preference, but I love wood grain. So to me, to cover that grain is a bit unsightly.......but again, just my opinion.

Agreed about the beauty of silked grain. I did mount the 2nd 'guard on my Richie Havens D40, very carefully, because it's just right for that guitar, lol. But man since the finish and wood have aged there's some beautiful silky ribbons on that puppy, and a little bit of it's hidden now. Thank god for that lower bout. Suspect they were still using up leftover Westerly wood too.

I was thinking about that specific thing last night......opinions. It occurred to me what the best guitar in the world is, and I know it for a fact. The BEST guitar is the guitar that is right for the individual, whether a $100 guitar or a $10,000 guitar, or maple or rosewood......it simply doesn't matter what I think or anyone else for that matter, it's all about personal preference........as in pickguards as well.

West

"Word"

 

[adorshki]

Here's a double pickguard for ya...
Bob Shane was a reckless strummer, so this saved his D-28 from an early grave.

Dunno if it could still be dug outta the archives, but years ago one of the Westerly guys, (think it was either Hideglue or WorkedinWesterly?)
told a story about re-furbing (at least) one of Havens' D40's. IIRC it was part of his endorsement deal with 'em. Anyway, also "IIRC" at least one top was deemed "unrecoverable" (maybe what led to the double 'guard idea?), and for sure there was also the "chewing gum" story, about finding gum stuck inside the top. (Wonder if that was his hack to slow down erosion until fix-it time?, LOL! )
Don't recall if it was all the same guitar.

 

[The Guilds of Grot]

Guild uses "Derek Smalls" (formerly of the band formerly known as Spinal Tap)

"You're killing me Smalls!"